Why Shouldn't I Go For A Core I7?

[Rodneyho]

Well because you didn't choose a MB with DDR3 for the Q9550 I would go for the I7. Just like others said you might see a TAD less CPU speed but your upward growth with an I7 board is far greater! Tri channel ram, the new processor socket... etc.

 

Send the other stuff back and get your I7.

 

Check out EVGA board as well. I am using the 790I FTW and its the best mobo I have ever owned. Used to be a ASUS only buyer but for some reason (combo deal that saved me $265) I decided to give EVGA a chance. Oh, I HATE MSI!

Edited December 7, 2008 by Rodneyho

[madu]

Appreciate all the replies guys.

I think it balances in the memory. As for DDR2 I can get a good, branded 4GB kit for around $100, but I will only be able to get a sub-par 3GB (Tri-channel) of DDR3.. I read that both the Asus P6T and Gigabyte UD5 doesnt really work well with dual-channel. So in that case I may hinder my performance compared to Q9550 system by going for average DDR3..

 

I don't know what to say except everyone here is right - I have both a QX9770 and a 'low end' i7 920, and at 3.8GHz, they both perform roughly identical in games.... +/-3FPS or so in Crysis.

 

However for $150, i7 certainly has the better value, and personally I wouldn't hesitate to upgrade. Your future upgrade options will be essentially limitless, overclockability is exceptional, and the x58 platform is really robust.

 

As a side note, I wouldn't rule out the Gigabyte UD5 board. While the Asus is probably more straightforward, the gigabyte has more tweaking options in the bios, and is compatible with Tri-SLI if you even decide to go that route. The slot layout of the Asus only supports 2x SLI.

 

 

Wouldn't you say there is any benefit with anything at all?

Like multi-tasking? I know the Core i7 really pushes some big numbers in PCMark or Sandra, but I don't know what those big numbers really means for a normal user.

 

I really like that Gigabyte UD5. I never see myself doing Tri-SLI, but I like to ttry the UD5, although the Asus P6T beats UD5 in every benchmark.

 

Also, I am wondering about going for a new platform afresh... is there risk in jumping to a platform couple of weeks old? or the BIOS updates will take care of it?

And finally, what DDR3 number should I look for? for examples, for a 400 FSB in DDR2, I need to get DDR2-800 (400x2).. is it the same for DDR3 with the on-chip memory controller? Do I multiply the FSB by 3? sorry for the noobish question.

 

Again thanks heaps for the help guys!

 

Cheers.

[robAP]

everyone is yelling "theres no gaming improvement in the i7 over the 775" well guess why? its not the chip! its the graphics cards. they are the bottleneck now. once the new gen cards come out, then you will see the performance of the game increase over the 775 as the bottleneck begins to return to the chip now. look at the data. run low settings, no aa, no filtering, and the i7 just stomps the 775 in the mud. crank up the candy thats loaded on the graphics cards and guess what you see? both behaving the same. that means its the cards that are the limit in games and thats why the i7 cant show its gaming performance. throw in 2009's newest card when it arrives and youll see the i7 begin to pull ahead....its not the chips fault.

 

if you go with i7, it will pull ahead once you upgrade graphics with the next gen cards.

[politbureau]

Wouldn't you say there is any benefit with anything at all?

Like multi-tasking? I know the Core i7 really pushes some big numbers in PCMark or Sandra, but I don't know what those big numbers really means for a normal user.

Honestly, I do see and 'feel' a small performance improvement under i7, but it is small and barely quantifiable without actual benchmarks. Windows starts faster, apps seem to be a little more responsive, but lets be honest - we're talking two bleeding edge hardware setups here, so I'd expect that to be the case anyway. Yes encoding and number crunching are faster, but the real advantage to you will be long term in terms of upgradability and piece of mind.

 

I really like that Gigabyte UD5. I never see myself doing Tri-SLI, but I like to ttry the UD5, although the Asus P6T beats UD5 in every benchmark.

Well I'd choose the Asus unless you want the option for Tri-SLI. The board layout is exceptional for non-tri-sli use, and leaves the most slots open even with 2 dual slot cards installed. It's also the easiest to use and has the best out of the box performance.

 

Also, I am wondering about going for a new platform afresh... is there risk in jumping to a platform couple of weeks old? or the BIOS updates will take care of it?

Good question. If you read anands review, they posed the exact same concern and question. In the case of the Asus board, IIRC they gave it props for being the only board to perform as expected out of the box. In that regard, it would be my pick. In terms of being weary of a new platform, I wouldn't worry at all. X58 is THE platform for i7, and we won't see lower end parts like X55 in the marketplace until much later in Q1'09. This means all the mfgs will be putting all their dev and effort behind this platform to try and put themselves on top of the performance heap and grab the defacto pole position. That means a ruthless pace of new BIOS releases and performance improvements. So no, I wouldn't worry at all.

 

And finally, what DDR3 number should I look for? for examples, for a 400 FSB in DDR2, I need to get DDR2-800 (400x2).. is it the same for DDR3 with the on-chip memory controller? Do I multiply the FSB by 3? sorry for the noobish question.

DDR3 on i7 is a bit odd. Unlike 790i where you can run the memory unlinked, with i7 you are stuck with memory dividers again. In this regard you can still fine tune RAM speeds, but you are bound by the multiplier restrictions.

 

I'm not a HUGE fan of THG reviews, but the overclocking chart on this page is very useful in figuring out what sort of RAM speeds you can expect at different FSBs: LINK. I am running the A-DATA kit with the 920 at 190FSB x 8 for DDR-1520. It's capable of more, but at this speed I can run at default voltage and keep ultra tight timings. 1T is even possible at lower speeds, but overall scores are better with the higher RAM speed.

 

If you can stretch your budget, the 6GB A-DATA kit that I am using is dirt cheap (C$230) and performs just as well at 1600-1800 as my top end corsair kit.

 

Good Luck!

[tkrow21]

I wouldn't purchase a core I7 machine right now. Once my processor starts to age, I'll stick a Q9550 and will still see a huge performance boost. I mean, like everyone has been saying, for gaming you should stick to Core 2's, but for other stuff you should go I7.

[politbureau]

I wouldn't purchase a core I7 machine right now. Once my processor starts to age, I'll stick a Q9550 and will still see a huge performance boost. I mean, like everyone has been saying, for gaming you should stick to Core 2's, but for other stuff you should go I7.

Well, as I see it...

 

Core i7 = Core 2 :: for Gaming

Core i7 > Core 2 :: for Everything else

Core i7 < Core 2 :: for Price

 

Also, I think we need to remember that X58 is a TOP end solution, and is the equivalent solution to 790i for Core 2. X55 will bring mobo prices down in the 1st quarter of 2009, but let's compare apples to apples here.

 

Using Newegg prices to compare the cheapest possible builds for each platform...

Core 2 Build

$299.99 - EVGA 790i (A1)

$319.99 - Q9450 (2.66GHz)

$ 99.99 - G.Skill 2x2GB DDR3-1333 (NQ)

Total: $719.97

Core i7 Build

$219.99 - MSI X58 Platinum

$299.99 - Core i7 920 (2.66GHz)

$109.99 - G.Skill 3x1GB DDR3-1333 (NQ)

Total: $629.97

 

Granted the Core 2 has 4GB vs 3GB on i7, but I think most people will agree that at $90 less than the equivalent Core 2 system, i7 is by far a better value.

[ir_cow]

Appreciate all the replies guys.

I think it balances in the memory. As for DDR2 I can get a good, branded 4GB kit for around $100, but I will only be able to get a sub-par 3GB (Tri-channel) of DDR3.. I read that both the Asus P6T and Gigabyte UD5 doesnt really work well with dual-channel. So in that case I may hinder my performance compared to Q9550 system by going for average DDR3..

 

 

good brand for $100? i got my OCZ reapers for $45 each thats 8gb of 4-4-4-15@800 or 5-5-5-18@1066 for under $90. right now ddr3 is very overpriced and you have to shell out atlest $150 for 3gbs

 

im also with politbureau on this one, in a year or less when DDR3 drops in price you can get more and switch out your cpu (i dunno why people think they can't sell parts after its used).

[WhenKittensATK]

Using Newegg prices to compare the cheapest possible builds for each platform...

Core 2 Build

$299.99 - EVGA 790i (A1)

$319.99 - Q9450 (2.66GHz)

$ 99.99 - G.Skill 2x2GB DDR3-1333 (NQ)

Total: $719.97

Core i7 Build

$219.99 - MSI X58 Platinum

$299.99 - Core i7 920 (2.66GHz)

$109.99 - G.Skill 3x1GB DDR3-1333 (NQ)

Total: $629.97

 

My Quad Core Upgrade was only $410 with an aftermarket heatsink.

 

$130 Biostar Tpower I45 (I bought it used, but you can get a decent Gigabyte for $130 new)

$190 Q6600

$45 2x 2GB G.Skill DDR2-1000

$37 Xigmatek HDT-S1283

 

$402 Total without shipping. Yes shipping was only $8 no lie.

 

Thus the cost of a C2D/C2Q is much less than an i7 build. Not everyone has $600-700 to spend on just a CPU upgrade. Q6600 is more than enough for most people. DDR3 is expensive and shows little increase for what you pay for it.

 

i7 as of now isn't worth it, unless you got a lot of money. Intel's 32nm i7 line comes out next year, worth the wait. Buy a C2D/C2Q now and sell it and upgrade to 32nm i7 later next year, if your not happy with its performance.

Edited December 7, 2008 by Krazyxazn

[politbureau]

My Quad Core Upgrade was only $410 with an aftermarket heatsink.

 

$130 Biostar Tpower I45 (I bought it used, but you can get a decent Gigabyte for $130 new)

$190 Q6600

$45 2x 2GB G.Skill DDR2-1000

$37 Xigmatek HDT-S1283

 

$402 Total without shipping. Yes shipping was only $8 no lie.

 

Thus the cost of a C2D/C2Q is much less than an i7 build. Not everyone has $600-700 to spend on just a CPU upgrade. Q6600 is more than enough for most people. DDR3 is expensive and shows little increase for what you pay for it.

 

i7 as of now isn't worth it, unless you got a lot of money. Intel's 32nm i7 line comes out next year, worth the wait. Buy a C2D/C2Q now and sell it and upgrade to 32nm i7 later next year, if your not happy with its performance.

Again, however, you are not comparing apples to apples. You are pricing out a much lower end motherboard, a CPU that has been in market for some time and has already had a revision and numerous price drops, RAM that is below spec and so on. I don't think that's really fair.

 

Conversely, if I gather your point to be thus, you are saying that you can get 80-90% of the performance for roughly $200 less, then wait and spend a smaller amount on upgrading to X55 and i7 once the prices have dropped. That I won't argue with, but you certainly won't be getting quite the same level of performance, the expansion and SLI capabilities, or the longevity or upgradability of a current platform. His original question was whether he should spend and extra $150 to get i7 vs Core 2, and I think that expenditure is valid and justifiable.

[cjloki]

you're asking a buncha compulsively power hungry megalotechnoheads why you "shouldn't" upgrade to the latest fastest thing ever....huh...??

[madu]

Hey guys..

 

Thanks a million for all the advice. I havent decided but I am more inclined towards the C2Q setup.

For several reasons:

 

1) X58 + i7 is a new platform and I think maybe the mobo's and even chipset is not matured enough.

2) No much competition among mobos. I mean for P45, if you take Asus or Gigabyte, they have more than a dozen different mobos...

3) I might not go SLI or XFire, in that case it would be worth to wait for the P55, which will also be a little matured over this period and a lot cheaper..

4) Next time I upgrade, it will be only mobo+CPU+ram, since I am buying the PSU+GPU this time.. so I wont be as much cash strapped next time...

 

I have to say #1 is the main reason for me back off... I mean Asus P6T is the best X58 board out there right now (Rampage is insanely overpriced for me), and even that is marketed as a mid-range mobo...

 

It is not the same here in Japan.. the prices are somewhat different (usually higher) than in US for branded stuff like ram, and also have to physically visit the area to find out the real prices... not possible online..if I could get the GTX260 Black edition for below $400 I would go Core i7...it is close to $500 here...

I thiink I will check out the prices and make the decision.. it is soo tempting to go i7 since I am doing this upgrade after about 3 years... yes guys... its been that long.. thats why this fuss is all about....

 

Appreciate all the help guys...

 

Cheers.