24 Hours of Le Mans - 77th Edition

[r3d c0m3t]

Look at some of the speeds the LM cars reached in the late 80s, quite a few of them used to reached 220MPH+ and a few even reached ~250MPH.

 

Looking at trap speeds beyond 1990 you very rarely see any car exceeding 125MPH, whether or not that has to with track layout changes or general regulations I do not know.

 

 

Still its like the groub B rally cars of that era, all power and no control.

 

Just like modern rally cars these newer LM cars have immense technological advancements over the top speed monsters of 86, 87 and 88 (I believe 88 was when the new track layout first appeared).

 

You're referring to two types of race types at once.

 

However, you make an interesting point that's been pointed out and proved more than once - so far back as the 20's, driver input was everything. Your car was only as fast as you could drive/handle it, now, it's mostly driven by technology. That's not to say driver input has diminished because at the end of the day that technology still relies on the driver no matter the advancements, but as far as really getting top tier performance out of the car like you would back in the good days...that's gone.

 

One of my favorite Group C racers is the 787B, glance over any informative profile you can find for it, you'll see that it dominated not only because it was pretty much the fastest prototype there, but the R26B engine was about 3x as reliable as a petrol or even a diesel engine is now for that matter. While those (petrol) racers were in the pits, Renown was still going strong....one of the reasons it was outlawed for the '92 race.

 

...Too much of an advantage, way to say "Sorry, your prototype is just better than everything else here" huh?

 

Still to this day it remains the only prototype using a Rotary engine to win Le Mans.

[Andrewr05]

You're referring to two types of race types at once.

Hmm?

 

I brought up group B rally cars because effectively the same thing occurred in rallying as well as the LeMans, the brute force cars were phased out (whether it be by necesity or regulation) and the teams wanted their laptimes to be just as fast (or faster) then the previous years so they effectively were forced to begin researching better racing technologies and could no longer rely on brute force and top speed to gain the fastest laptime...

 

However, you make an interesting point that's been pointed out and proved more than once - so far back as the 20's, driver input was everything. Your car was only as fast as you could drive/handle it, now, it's mostly driven by technology. That's not to say driver input has diminished because at the end of the day that technology still relies on the driver no matter the advancements, but as far as really getting top tier performance out of the car like you would back in the good days...that's gone.

I agree a lot more relies on the companies overall budget/technology then it did back in the day...

 

One of my favorite Group C racers is the 787B, glance over any informative profile you can find for it, you'll see that it dominated not only because it was pretty much the fastest prototype there, but the R26B engine was about 3x as reliable as a petrol or even a diesel engine is now for that matter. While those (petrol) racers were in the pits, Renown was still going strong....one of the reasons it was outlawed for the '92 race.

 

...Too much of an advantage, way to say "Sorry, your prototype is just better than everything else here" huh?

 

Still to this day it remains the only prototype using a Rotary engine to win Le Mans.

Yeah that car was badass.

 

However, the only experience I can say that I have with the 787B is GT4.

 

That one of the fastest cars in GT4, I'm pretty sure I achieved my highest speed in one of those (like 250MPH or something).

[r3d c0m3t]

Hmm?

 

I brought up group B rally cars because effectively the same thing occurred in rallying as well as the LeMans, the brute force cars were phased out (whether it be by necesity or regulation) and the teams wanted their laptimes to be just as fast (or faster) then the previous years so they effectively were forced to begin researching better racing technologies and could no longer rely on brute force and top speed to gain the fastest laptime...

 

Ah, my mistake.

 

I love, rather I loved watching WRC or the random rallying events that were shown on Speedvision, always had a bit of a soft spot for Makinen.

 

Now with Speed all we get is CRAPCAR, seriously, not trying to offend anyone if you're a NASCAR fan that's great I can appreciate that...but for my reasons I could pass on it any day. I'm lucky enough they still cover Formula 1. Always enjoy finding out someone has played either Gran Turismo, the 787B sounds like a beast too.

 

- Threw that in for fun. B:) Edited June 18, 2009 by r3d c0m3t

[Andrewr05]

I love, rather I loved watching WRC or the random rallying events that were shown on Speedvision, always had a bit of a soft spot for Makinen.

 

Now with Speed all we get is CRAPCAR, seriously, not trying to offend anyone if you're a NASCAR fan that's great I can appreciate that...but for my reasons I could pass on it any day. I'm lucky enough they still cover Formula 1.

I know what you mean, I was pissed when I went to watch WRC and Speed didn't carry it anymore.

 

I looked everywhere online, not even Speed's official website implicated that they dropped WRC, I ended up finding info about why they dropped it on some obscure forum.

 

- Threw that in for fun. B:)

That sounds incredible, just think that was probably only like 5-6K rpm at the most, those engines can rev to ~10k...

[r3d c0m3t]

I know what you mean, I was pissed when I went to watch WRC and Speed didn't carry it anymore.

 

I looked everywhere online, not even Speed's official website implicated that they dropped WRC, I ended up finding info about why they dropped it on some obscure forum.

 

That sounds incredible, just think that was probably only like 5-6K rpm at the most, those engines can rev to ~10k...

 

Why'd they drop it?

 

You might be dead on, I never paid much attention to the small audience around the car...but they don't have any ear plugs on, they'd be deaf.

[Andrewr05]

Why'd they drop it?

It all started with manufacturers dropping their factory teams (I think 07' only had 3 factory teams in the whole line up), hence less marketability hence SPEED's "higher ups" deeming the races not worthy of airing because of less ad money via airing WRC.

 

They make more money in the US of A focusing on Nascar then they do all the other races, DTM and other touring car championship races are non-existent on SPEED as well.

 

 

I miss watching the Dakar events too...

[r3d c0m3t]

Speed has turned into the equivalent of FOX.

 

I can't remember the last time I've seen Motorweek or Autoweek (probably dropped that too). Everything on TV is going for the worse these days.

 

Can't remember the last time I've seen a DTM or a Pikes Peak event.

[Great_Gig]

That's awesome. That mean you had a chance to see the XJR-9's and whatnot.

Indeed I did, I was at the 88 24 Hour race when the 9 won - pretty special. What made it sweet for me was Johnny Dumfries and Andy Wallace being in the winning car and Derek Bell coming second! Funny, but I had not missed going until you started this topic, now I am thinking about next year! It's been awhile and it was great there. But the Mulsanne is not quite the same now and the speeds were in the mid 200's in those days! There is a great cafe/restaurant half way down the straight, where you could have a Chinese meal, a few beers and then stand right by the fence and 'feel' them roaring past! After that we normally went out to Arnage and Indianapolis to catch a good look at them, as they went through the corners. . . . . Happy days.

 

http://wikimapia.org/#lat=47.921465&lo...amp;m=a&v=2

 

(this map is great, zoom out a bit and you can see the lot)

 

And who remembers this?

 

Edited June 15, 2009 by Great_Gig

[r3d c0m3t]

Those super-light CLK-GTR's, and they cost an arm and a leg for a road car.

 

Isn't that an Oreca GTS-R behind the LMR?

 

What's the environment like at Le Mans, is it all excitement or is it more subtle than one might think?