Stoopid RAM questions

[EkomsDeew]

You dont really need to read the first paragraph. its not that important.... just kinda makes me look like i got downs

 

 

i pretty much got into computers last summer and it felt like i had learned alot about them (i was wrong), then my bro's computer broke a few months so he gave it to me cuz he couldnt fix it. well i stopped keeping up with with computers cuz school started up a long time ago and i didnt have any free time. well i was gonna get on a forum and see if they would help me fix but im kinda cocky so i just kinda started poking around, and reseated everything. i found out that the HDD wasnt hooked up right so i fixed that but it still didnt work. so i took the CPU off as it was the last thing i was gonna reseat. when i was gonna put it back on i got lazy and left the heatsink on the CPU witch kinda made it hard to line up all the little mettle prongs (or whatever you call the mettle things that go in the MoBo), and didnt relize how weak they were. i pushed it down pretty hard and bent a bunch of the prongs so now im typing this on my moms Dell. so i want to either fix that computer or build a new one but i dont want to make anymore stupid mistakes, so on to the questions.

 

i have no idea what latency timings for RAMs are, or how to kno if they are stable. i kno there numbers and thats about it (for example 5-5-5-15) <---- honestly idk if im even calling it the right thing. i also have kno idea how to tell what a good timing is.

 

any help is appriciated cuz i really dont feel like reseaching stuff cuz im still pretty busy with school and w/e.

[GabrielT]

Well depending on the rams speed that timing would be different. But I am just assuming that that ram is ddr2 800. As for the cpu I am a bit confused about exactly how you dit it but you did it so now you have to fix it. Ok, first, take a credit card, or credit card like thing and run it down the rows if they aren't too bent. For the pins that are more bent than that take the a .7mm mechanical pencil and slide the end over the pins and straighten them that way. hope I could help.

 

Oh by the way, tighter ram timings will never make a noticeable difference in performance unless you are bench marking.

[EkomsDeew]

Well depending on the rams speed that timing would be different. But I am just assuming that that ram is ddr2 800. As for the cpu I am a bit confused about exactly how you dit it but you did it so now you have to fix it. Ok, first, take a credit card, or credit card like thing and run it down the rows if they aren't too bent. For the pins that are more bent than that take the a .7mm mechanical pencil and slide the end over the pins and straighten them that way. hope I could help.

i was just using the timing as an example i have no idea what timing my RAM actually has, i just kno its DDR. my computer is really outdated but i got it for free so i cant complain. i bent alot of the prongs on my cpu back into place but ended up snapping some off so there isnt any fixin it anymore. its not a big deal it was and AMD sempron so ill just buy a new CPU probably. im probably gonna end up buildin a new system and just use some parts from this computer on it when i get a job.

 

thanks for the help but were u saying that RAM timings really dont mean anything and dont really matter at all exept for benchmarking?

[GabrielT]

i was just using the timing as an example i have no idea what timing my RAM actually has, i just kno its DDR. my computer is really outdated but i got it for free so i cant complain. i bent alot of the prongs on my cpu back into place but ended up snapping some off so there isnt any fixin it anymore. its not a big deal it was and AMD sempron so ill just buy a new CPU probably. im probably gonna end up buildin a new system and just use some parts from this computer on it when i get a job.

 

thanks for the help but were u saying that RAM timings really dont mean anything and dont really matter at all exept for benchmarking?

Well, if you only broke a couple it might still work.

 

Edited because I don't know what the hell I'm talking about

 

Umm, if someone has a better definition of timings give a shout out. To me it is the time they take to respond to being needed. Ugh that sounds terrible. Well they aren't hugely important but they can be a factor.

Edited April 29, 2010 by gabrieltessin

[ebarone]

I'll chime in on what I know with the timings...

 

There is a rate at which communication happens between the processor and the memory. I dont mean in how much data is transferred, but how many times there exists the possibility of a transfer. Its a clock rate, and its that familiar number that you see when you buy RAM... for example, 800 MHz. Its known as the clock rate, and its the number of times every second that the processor and the memory *have a chance to* talk back and forth.

 

When the processor needs some data that isnt stored in its own on-die cache (thats the L1, L2 thing you may have heard of before), it sends a request to the RAM for the data. When the RAM recieves that data request, it has to access the address that data is stored in. The RAM timings that you are talking about, in the format 5-5-5-15 or whatever, is basically the number of clock cycles it takes for each step of data retrieval done by the RAM. The four numbers you see are only four of about 50 different timings associated with RAM, those simply are the most common and some of the biggest impactors.

 

So CPU needs data... asks RAM... RAM takes X number of clock cycles to access the data and send it back to the CPU. That X is determined by the timings. When overclocking, you have 2 options to speed the system- lower the timing numbers so it requires fewer clock cycles to retrieve data, or increase the number of clock cycles per second. Or both, which is what most people do.

 

I hope that wasnt too confusing... I stink at explaining things sometimes

[wevsspot]

Ekoms,

 

Dont stress yourself out over memory timings. Install the memory, clear the cmos, reboot back into the BIOS and load optimized defaults or setup defaults. Millions of computers are built and shipped every day with all of the BIOS settings at auto.

 

If you aren't looking to overclock, benchmark, or squeeze every last drop of performance out of those ram modules, you are just creating extra headaches for yourself.

 

There are literally thousands of articles, explanations and guides out there that will tell you everything you want/need to know about memory timings if you're so inclined. But like I said - you're creating a lot of pain for yourself that isn't necessary.

[EkomsDeew]

Ekoms,

 

Dont stress yourself out over memory timings. Install the memory, clear the cmos, reboot back into the BIOS and load optimized defaults or setup defaults. Millions of computers are built and shipped every day with all of the BIOS settings at auto.

 

If you aren't looking to overclock, benchmark, or squeeze every last drop of performance out of those ram modules, you are just creating extra headaches for yourself.

 

There are literally thousands of articles, explanations and guides out there that will tell you everything you want/need to know about memory timings if you're so inclined. But like I said - you're creating a lot of pain for yourself that isn't necessary.

 

well right now my computer is all messed up so im gonna scrape together about $500 and build myself a new system, but im trying to learn as much as i can about computers because im getting a job at best buy in about a month (hopefully) and next year im taking some classes to be a certified computer technition or somthin like that. anyway, i spent most of last summer reaserching how to build a pc and how to tell what components and companies are reliable (just really basic stuff). but my bro gave me a broken computer a while ago and i kind of relized i dont know much about computers. so lately ive been trying to find stuff on the internet about recondnizing what component failed, what is really neccisarry as far as performance goes. (i worded that really wierd but i really dont know how to say that) what i mean by that is like what stats REALLY make a difference in performance. but i really dont know where to figure stuff like this out, so if you have any links/sites/advise please post.

[EkomsDeew]

I'll chime in on what I know with the timings...

 

There is a rate at which communication happens between the processor and the memory. I dont mean in how much data is transferred, but how many times there exists the possibility of a transfer. Its a clock rate, and its that familiar number that you see when you buy RAM... for example, 800 MHz. Its known as the clock rate, and its the number of times every second that the processor and the memory *have a chance to* talk back and forth.

 

When the processor needs some data that isnt stored in its own on-die cache (thats the L1, L2 thing you may have heard of before), it sends a request to the RAM for the data. When the RAM recieves that data request, it has to access the address that data is stored in. The RAM timings that you are talking about, in the format 5-5-5-15 or whatever, is basically the number of clock cycles it takes for each step of data retrieval done by the RAM. The four numbers you see are only four of about 50 different timings associated with RAM, those simply are the most common and some of the biggest impactors.

 

So CPU needs data... asks RAM... RAM takes X number of clock cycles to access the data and send it back to the CPU. That X is determined by the timings. When overclocking, you have 2 options to speed the system- lower the timing numbers so it requires fewer clock cycles to retrieve data, or increase the number of clock cycles per second. Or both, which is what most people do.

 

I hope that wasnt too confusing... I stink at explaining things sometimes

 

that actually makes alot of sense (i didnt really know the importance of cache on a CPU untill now also) . honestly i think you explained that pretty good for it being such a confusing process to explain.

 

also thanks eveyone for all the replies this is really helpfull.

[Chadwick0]

well i looked through most of those replies, pretty good answers on RAM timings, the only thing you need to look at is the MHZ and pc6400, pc8500, etc depending on what type of RAM.

Also sounds like you need some more info than just on RAM, make sure your CPU, Mobo, and RAM are all compatible, AMD makes their sockets the easiest to understand and the price diff. is amazing along with performance being just as good. intels better benchmarks are nothing but bragging rights. Once you find the CPU you want, find a MOBO with the correct socket, then make sure what RAM the mobo accepts, DDR 2 and DDR 3 are the main ones right now. Also please, for your own good, never seat a CPU in a socket putting any kind of pressure on it, check the corners for an arrow or pin pattern and line it up right and it should fall in on its own. and the heatsink always needs a fresh coat of thermal paste on a new install/re-seat, AMD heatsinks come with it pre-applied, may not be top of the line but for keeping stock speeds it does the job and makes things go WAY easier. old parts from a DDR (1) computer are probably not compatible, power supply is prolly out-dated too. hard drive MAY work but that could have been the dead part in the 1st place. I THINK the newer Semprons are made with a different socket than the old ones, so i doubt just getting another sempron would work on that MOBO. i'd wait for your tech class and learn as much as you can there. if its a college or trade school they might even help you choose parts and bring them in for a hands on training for your own machine. Good luck.

[EkomsDeew]

well i looked through most of those replies, pretty good answers on RAM timings, the only thing you need to look at is the MHZ and pc6400, pc8500, etc depending on what type of RAM.

Also sounds like you need some more info than just on RAM, make sure your CPU, Mobo, and RAM are all compatible, AMD makes their sockets the easiest to understand and the price diff. is amazing along with performance being just as good. intels better benchmarks are nothing but bragging rights. Once you find the CPU you want, find a MOBO with the correct socket, then make sure what RAM the mobo accepts, DDR 2 and DDR 3 are the main ones right now. Also please, for your own good, never seat a CPU in a socket putting any kind of pressure on it, check the corners for an arrow or pin pattern and line it up right and it should fall in on its own. and the heatsink always needs a fresh coat of thermal paste on a new install/re-seat, AMD heatsinks come with it pre-applied, may not be top of the line but for keeping stock speeds it does the job and makes things go WAY easier. old parts from a DDR (1) computer are probably not compatible, power supply is prolly out-dated too. hard drive MAY work but that could have been the dead part in the 1st place. I THINK the newer Semprons are made with a different socket than the old ones, so i doubt just getting another sempron would work on that MOBO. i'd wait for your tech class and learn as much as you can there. if its a college or trade school they might even help you choose parts and bring them in for a hands on training for your own machine. Good luck.

 

ok i know how to build computer and knowing if parts are compatible with eachother but i dont kno all the stuff that makes a component really good or why it really matters (for instance i knew cache was important but i didnt know why it was.)

[ebarone]

If you want a very technical article explaining timings and clock speeds, here is one from Anandtech.com, a go-to source for me usually. Its pretty techy until the last page, when he starts talking to you like you're in 2nd grade for the 5th time because you kept failing lunch, but its still a very helpful article and I reference it every time I forget whats what.

[slick2500]

If you want a very technical article explaining timings and clock speeds, here is one from Anandtech.com, a go-to source for me usually. Its pretty techy until the last page, when he starts talking to you like you're in 2nd grade for the 5th time because you kept failing lunch, but its still a very helpful article and I reference it every time I forget whats what.

That made my day right there.