Peltier Cooling for computer parts

[Enjin]

I saw this thing at The Source, which used to be Radio Shack, a USB Mini Refrigerator. I was like...what the?!?!

 

I figured they would just stick a heatsink and a fan under my pop can or something stupid and call it a day.

 

But in researching how the thing works, I learned about the Peltier Effect!

 

and this raised the question, why arent CPUs and such cooled this way? if you slap that block from the vid on the back of your cpu, wouldn't that be more effective than pretty much any cooling solution?

 

The guy did say that the thing he was using was really cheap, but used like 46 watts of power...is power consumtion the only reason these arent used for CPUs and whatnot?

 

because my GPU is having some heat issues, and Im thinking about shoving a few of these babies into my case.

[scr4wl]

This can be done.

 

hardnrg did a review on a Peltier waterblock.

[hardnrg]

why arent CPUs and such cooled this way?

they can be.. check out CoolIT, the company

 

if you DIY it, be prepared for disasters, or at least a lot of messing about

[NCC10281982B]

they can be.. check out CoolIT, the company

 

if you DIY it, be prepared for disasters, or at least a lot of messing about

+1

 

Been there did that, did not enjoy it.

[Enjin]

Ugh....

 

that looks like a big mess that I don't really wanna deal with...

I did some reading on my own too, and found that the main problems are:

 

->Condensation

->If something fails, the Peltier block may continue to heat up after it is shut down, and burn your chip anyways

->High power requirements, and the need for power-hungry and loud fans

 

I think I may still buy one and see how much of a difference I can make blowing cold air into the case.

 

My idea was basically to buy a Thermalright True kind of heatsink and mount the peltier where the cpu would go, then have that blow in as an intake fan

what do you guys think?

[hardnrg]

the other side of the TEC would get hot... and then the cool side wouldn't stay cold

 

have you ever seen a USB fridge or USB drink chiller... they use TEC elements... and they're near useless

 

you can't make an airconditioner with a 25W TEC element

 

spend the money you were going to on all this TEC cooling on watercooling or an aircon unit

[NCC10281982B]

+1 again

 

Between the amount of money I spent on water cooling + Pelts + pelt PSU I could have bought a phase change cooler.

BTW when I tried to run the pelt off the rigs psu I blew the main fuse.

 

edit: dammit Steve I need to stop agreeing with you.

[Enjin]

have you ever seen a USB fridge or USB drink chiller

Thats exactly where I got the Idea! LOL

I work at the The Source(Radio Shack) and I picked up a USB Fridge for 9.96, minus employee discount of course..LOL

gutted the poor thing right there on the counter...only the heatsink, fan and peltier made it out alive

 

it doesn't get super cold, but I'm thinking that If I give it a little more juice than it would get from a USB slot, It might give me something.

It's kind of an experiment right now..

I have the front section of my case where HDs usually go emptied and sealed off. I have 1 120mm Fan blowing over the Video card into the case, and two 80mm fans blowing under it. This chamber is completely sealer, so the fans suck cool air through the front grill and dispense it into the case. Im gonna put the peltier and its heatsink in that chamber.

 

BTW when I tried to run the pelt off the rigs psu I blew the main fuse.

 

ehehe...I figured something like this may happen, so I havn't tried it yet.. this peltier works directly off the USB power, with no resistors or anything in between, but I assume the USB power must limited right?

So I need to

-figure out what the maximum volts and amps I can pull through this thing(hopefully 12 volts)

-figure out how much power one of my molex connectors would be willing to dish out

-find out what kind of resistors I need to limit this thing so it wont guzzle all of my electricity!

 

any advice on all that ^^^ would be much appreciated =)

 

I can post pictures and results when Its done too if anyone is interested..lol

 

peace

[hardnrg]

This chamber is completely sealer, so the fans suck cool air through the front grill and dispense it into the case. Im gonna put the peltier and its heatsink in that chamber.

You've completely overlooked the need to cool the hot side of the peltier. You'd need a SECOND heatsink to cool the hot side, which would be cooled with a fan, blowing warm air off the heatsink (into your room).

 

TEC elements are something like 50% efficient, so you'd need to create a MASSIVE heatload on the second heatsink to get noticeable cooling on the cold heatsink...

 

Using TECs to cool air is the wrong way to use them. You can use them to cool liquid or have them in direct contact with processors, but even then they are still very inefficient for the amount of power required.

 

There is not a chance in hell of a USB Fridge TEC element cooling your case by 1

[Enjin]

You've completely overlooked the need to cool the hot side of the peltier. You'd need a SECOND heatsink to cool the hot side, which would be cooled with a fan, blowing warm air off the heatsink (into your room).

 

TEC elements are something like 50% efficient, so you'd need to create a MASSIVE heatload on the second heatsink to get noticeable cooling on the cold heatsink...

 

Using TECs to cool air is the wrong way to use them. You can use them to cool liquid or have them in direct contact with processors, but even then they are still very inefficient for the amount of power required.

 

There is not a chance in hell of a USB Fridge TEC element cooling your case by 1

[RHKCommander959]

and this raised the question, why arent CPUs and such cooled this way? if you slap that block from the vid on the back of your cpu, wouldn't that be more effective than pretty much any cooling solution?

 

The guy did say that the thing he was using was really cheap, but used like 46 watts of power...is power consumtion the only reason these arent used for CPUs and whatnot?

 

because my GPU is having some heat issues, and Im thinking about shoving a few of these babies into my case.

CPU's are cooled by peltier effects by some users, I myself have in the past. Quad cores dump too much heat for it to make much sense to use a peltier versus a phase system because the cost wont be much less but the cooling ability is worse. Peltiers are rated for a maximum amount of heat they can transfer. Peltiers range in their available wattages but USB doesnt give much power at all, a couple watts.

 

 

 

it doesn't get super cold, but I'm thinking that If I give it a little more juice than it would get from a USB slot, It might give me something.

It's kind of an experiment right now..

I have the front section of my case where HDs usually go emptied and sealed off. I have 1 120mm Fan blowing over the Video card into the case, and two 80mm fans blowing under it. This chamber is completely sealer, so the fans suck cool air through the front grill and dispense it into the case. Im gonna put the peltier and its heatsink in that chamber.

 

ehehe...I figured something like this may happen, so I havn't tried it yet.. this peltier works directly off the USB power, with no resistors or anything in between, but I assume the USB power must limited right?

So I need to

-figure out what the maximum volts and amps I can pull through this thing(hopefully 12 volts)

-figure out how much power one of my molex connectors would be willing to dish out

-find out what kind of resistors I need to limit this thing so it wont guzzle all of my electricity!

 

Find otu which peltier was in the usb cooler, I can guarantee it isn't suitable for direct-cpu cooling. To use the peltier as a chiller for air, you need an internal coldplate heat sink to cool the air and an external heat sink to cool the peltier. using a peltier for an air chiller does not really work too good unfortunately. You gotta Peltiers do NOT create coldness. They are a heat PUMP, so one side will get cold as the other inversely gets hot-the peltier also must work so it adds some heat load.

 

The pelt will be limited way before the molex adapter since its a tiny tec. I highly doubt its even a 50mm peltier. The peltier itself is a resistor so it cant guzzle infinite amounts of energy - also you shouldn't run a tec at 100% of its rated Voltage or over - they arent as efficient at full power = they waste more energy. Charts exist to show the sweeet spot but I'd guess around 80% or so of its rated voltage is a good start. when you get a real tec with higher wattage then you might need a independent PSU for the tec itself because thin gauge wires can get very hot and melt the insulation off leading to an eventual shorting, or the psu could fail. I haven't had a problem running a 226w peltier straight off of the molex power of my old 750w PSU but I like the meanwells since they allow voltage adjustment which I talked about earlier with Undervolting a peltier.

 

 

I haven't overlooked anything...now you wanna put your money where your mouth is?

Is the peltier sealed? if it isn't and goes sub-ambient then condensation will start destruction.

 

 

Novelty peltiers such as USB soda coolers are best used for WATER chillers where ehat is pulled out of the loop. air chilling is an epic waste for peltier power - the cold side needs to get cold to work more efficiently. When done properly peltiers can be a great asset to overclockers who want a nice jump. But done improperly can ruin a nice system. If you have a dual core CPU and a decent clocking motherboard then I'd suggest starting off with at least a 226w peltier on water cooling with insulation such as dielectric grease and neoprene/putty and rtv sealant on the peltier if none is present. if you got a quad core then I wouldn't bother - or at elast start with a 360w peltier but you wont gain more than a few hundred mhz over a solid water system :thumbs-up:

 

that peltier may be suited for chipset cooling, but it will take a little work setting up and will depend on your chipset and the actual rating of the peltier. First thing you should do before anything else is figure out what ratings the peltier has in the usb cooler or model number.

 

 

http://www.swiftnets.com/products/mcw5002.asp Thats the first peltier water block I had, the guy before me didn't do his homework and destroyed a socket A system, so i got a full water cooling kit plus meanwell power supply for 20$. two black ice 120mm radiators, laing d4, peltier block, 320w meanwell psu, 2 5.25" bay reservoirs... he also fried the pelt... Must have smelt great . I did my homework, replaced the dead pelt and got it roaring on a dfi cfx3200 with a amd x2 3800 and got 3.4ghz nice and icy after soem modification and motherboard insulation - it had a bad IHS on it too which I removed later and then insulated the exposed cpu. Moral of the story - do your homework. If your still thinking about using that peltier for an air chiller then you haven't read enough!!!

 

 

 

-----p.s.-----

If you do decide to mount a peltier, make sure the entire surface is covered by both the hot and cold plate, and both should sandwich the peltier - pressure is crucial for peltier effectiveness.

Edited September 10, 2009 by RHKCommander959

[hardnrg]

I haven't overlooked anything...now you wanna put your money where your mouth is?

Maybe I misunderstood...

 

From what I gather, you intend to put the cold side of a TEC element on a heatsink, and blow cold air into a case.

 

And you are leaving the hot side UNSINKED...

 

It would be like having watercooling with no radiator... you need to expel the heat of the TEC, and I can't see any mention of it.

 

At best, the hot and cold side of the TEC would reach an equal temperature, near ambient...

 

At worst, the TEC will burn...

 

So, I don't fancy your chances, even if you used a 500W TEC element, it won't cool for more than a minute, if that!