building a pc for my brother in law.

[Dan42684]

Hey fellas, I have a brother in law who wants to build a custom pc (non-gaming). The following is his needs as far as what he is going to do with it.

 

Music Recording

Graphics (architecture, autocad, drawing)

Lots of Space on the Hard Drive

going to be using Excel, powerpoint, access and various budget programs.

needs to have a very stable OS.

 

Since I don't have a good knowledge for non gaming systems I think some of you guys with more experience can help out. Thanks in advance.

[Darkorb]

Im not too sure how much CPU power is needed for those programs, but heres my blurb

 

q6600

8600gt

Seagate 1TB

XP

2 gb of any ram

Gigabyte P35

OCZ 600watt/700watt/Corsair 620

[Dan42684]

don't think he's gonna need that kind of video card for his needs. Anybody else?

[Guest element]

Well the CAD site says a "128meg graphics card" So perhaps it's more vram limited than GPU. I'll try to find out more correct and specific info.

[Angry_Games]

don't think he's gonna need that kind of video card for his needs. Anybody else?

 

if he wants to do 3d stuff like architecture and rendering, an 8600GT is the lowest place I would start. If he's going to do professional style CAD etc, you'll want to get him a low-end workstation card like FireGL or Quadro etc...but an 8600GT or 3850 (ATI) would be the place to start.

 

Q6600 might be overboard, just about any dual-core Intel Core2 chip will work, but the Q6600 is the best bang for the buck for cpu power right now.

 

500GB+ hdd's are everywhere. Cheap too.

 

Gigabyte 965 or P35 motherboard, take your pick, plenty to choose from.

 

OCZ or Corsair DDR2-800, plenty to choose from with great rebates (and great prices before rebates!)

 

since he's into audio/recording, find out which kinds of audio/recording. If he's into just music like ripping cd's or creating music with software, a good card with the Oxygen chip (like an Azuntech) is the way to go. If he's into music creation with external audio sources like instruments, MIDI, etc, then something like the Creative EMU card is the way to go.

 

Stable OS = Windows XP any flavor except 64-bit. So Home or Pro. Take your pick. But not Vista.

[nghisus]

Instead of going with the super large HD. Go with 2 500GB and setup it up for Raid-0. Sata Raid-0 is much more stable than IDE raid in my experience. It will be nice if he's dealing with large files because Raid is much faster.

[Angry_Games]

I never recommend RAID to anyone unless they are either:

 

1. enterprise/corporate customers who need redundancy (and then it's the $500+ RAID card that can do real hardware RAID-5 for performance + redundancy)

 

2. enthusiasts like us who know wtf they are doing

 

RAID, while never causing me a single problem in years, is not something you want to go giving someone else, especially since you'll notice in your experience that everyone else has many more computer issues than you yourself will have. There's a reason for this (I'll let you think about it lol).

 

RAID-1 is the only RAID solution I will give to non-enthusiast, non-enterprise customers. RAID-0 is too much risk.

 

Just because I or nghisus or others here might have never had much problem with it in our experience does NOT equate to every other person on earth not ever having a problem with it.

 

Stick to the basics, and just get a large 500+ GB drive, as from what you've described as the usage of the machine to us, there's no need for RAID at all (especially with a dvd-rw drive handy)

[Dan42684]

if he wants to do 3d stuff like architecture and rendering, an 8600GT is the lowest place I would start. If he's going to do professional style CAD etc, you'll want to get him a low-end workstation card like FireGL or Quadro etc...but an 8600GT or 3850 (ATI) would be the place to start.

 

Q6600 might be overboard, just about any dual-core Intel Core2 chip will work, but the Q6600 is the best bang for the buck for cpu power right now.

 

500GB+ hdd's are everywhere. Cheap too.

 

Gigabyte 965 or P35 motherboard, take your pick, plenty to choose from.

 

OCZ or Corsair DDR2-800, plenty to choose from with great rebates (and great prices before rebates!)

 

since he's into audio/recording, find out which kinds of audio/recording. If he's into just music like ripping cd's or creating music with software, a good card with the Oxygen chip (like an Azuntech) is the way to go. If he's into music creation with external audio sources like instruments, MIDI, etc, then something like the Creative EMU card is the way to go.

 

Stable OS = Windows XP any flavor except 64-bit. So Home or Pro. Take your pick. But not Vista.

 

he's going to be recording his own music pretty much, thanks for the great info A_G.

 

is this the card you were talking about?

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16829102014

[nghisus]

I never recommend RAID to anyone unless they are either:

 

1. enterprise/corporate customers who need redundancy (and then it's the $500+ RAID card that can do real hardware RAID-5 for performance + redundancy)

 

2. enthusiasts like us who know wtf they are doing

 

RAID, while never causing me a single problem in years, is not something you want to go giving someone else, especially since you'll notice in your experience that everyone else has many more computer issues than you yourself will have. There's a reason for this (I'll let you think about it lol).

 

RAID-1 is the only RAID solution I will give to non-enthusiast, non-enterprise customers. RAID-0 is too much risk.

 

Just because I or nghisus or others here might have never had much problem with it in our experience does NOT equate to every other person on earth not ever having a problem with it.

 

I kind agree with where you are coming from. But I guess its all in risk versus reward. For someone who moves large files on a daily basis I feel like it's worth it because to me it is that much faster. But there is the inherent risk of HD failure is now doubled because you depend on two HD's working instead of just one. So to clarify if he goes with RAID-0 he should use redundancy and add a mirror Raid as well. I guess the counter to the argument would be it never hurts to try something new, but I guess it's best if you try it yourself first. Like I said before I used to have issues with IDE Raid-0 but I move movies files back and forth all day long on 2 500GB SATA Raid-0's with no issues. It's all gravy. Is a Raid necessary? Absolutely not. Is it nice to have? I'd say so

[Angry_Games]

I kind agree with where you are coming from. But I guess its all in risk versus reward. For someone who moves large files on a daily basis I feel like it's worth it because to me it is that much faster. But there is the inherent risk of HD failure is now doubled because you depend on two HD's working instead of just one. So to clarify if he goes with RAID-0 he should use redundancy and add a mirror Raid as well. I guess the counter to the argument would be it never hurts to try something new, but I guess it's best if you try it yourself first. Like I said before I used to have issues with IDE Raid-0 but I move movies files back and forth all day long on 2 500GB SATA Raid-0's with no issues. It's all gravy. Is a Raid necessary? Absolutely not. Is it nice to have? I'd say so

keep in mind again that you are an enthusiast who tends to have less problems with computers. This could be because you are experienced and recognize and neutralize problems easily, or because of your experience you know exactly how things should be put together and software loaded.

 

As someone who has been doing this for about 10 years now, I'm simply amazed at the number of times I or other good techs have built a KILLER machine for someone, only to have that machine come back repeatedly, over and over, to be fixed or such because of problems. Yet the ENTIRE time we were building the rig, and everytime it comes back for repair, there's never any problem with it after we fix whatever the owner screwed up on it somehow (and how they screw it up sometimes is SIMPLY AMAZING!).

 

So when you are recommending something to someone, the most important thing you can do is remember that it is THEM, not YOU, who will be using the rig day in and day out. Ask yourself, do I really want to be 24/7 support for this guy? Even if he's my brother? Whom I love more than my own wife because only brothers have that type of bond?

 

If you answer yes to that (I never do, I give my best friends/family simple but powerful machines that aren't going to have a lot of problems because I build them simple), then I guess that's how it is.

 

But when recommending to strangers here, it's more in their interest to avoid certain pitfalls, like SLI, RAID, etc. Stuff that is no-brainer for us quickly becomes a technical nightmare for regular everyday joes who don't give a crap about anything but a machine that works and doesn't make him wait all day to do it.

 

Is a single 500GB drive good enough for you and moving movie files? Maybe not.

 

Is it good enough for someone who is building a rig for someone else who really doesn't need RAID for what they are using the computer for? No. It's not worth the hassle for the person on the other end who has to support it, which in turn means we end up having to support him to support his guy etc.

 

We love supporting our users, no question about that...that's why this site is still around. But it's the unnecessary support that we try to avoid. Common sense and logic dictate that what is good for you isn't really always good for someone else, and that's especially true when you get into technical matters.

 

Is it good for you to flash the chip inside your car's engine to fiddle with the gas-to-air ratio giving you more boost through the 3rd and 4th gear powerband? Sure because you know what you are doing (we hope haha...sometimes we don't though!).

 

Is it good for you to recommend Joe Average to do such a thing when he only wants to listen to his iPod through his stereo on his way to work? No, not really.

 

 

What I'm getting at is when you use your voice in this section for recommendations, you have to understand who you are talking to and what they need instead of just telling someone they need what you have because you use it and never had a problem with it.

 

We'd rather see Dan come back and say man that was a killer rig and he's super happy with it, than to have him come back and post a thread saying "ok why the %$@$#@ do I start to install windows and then after it loads it says it can't find my RAID hdd's?" or "my brother decided to add a dvd-rw and now his RAID array is broken and 234GB of his created music are lost!!!!".

 

Dan seems like a nice chap who understand enough about computers to not be too dangerous (hell, he might be a master tech-overclocker secretly on assignment from XS forums to test our knowledge! lol), and has enough common sense to ask experienced opinions.

 

Do we know if he's willing to push the risks of something like RAID or Crossfire on to someone else who obviously has even less knowledge and experience about computer tech to the point he has to ask his brother Dan to help him build one?

 

I don't know Dan that well. I know him well enough to know he asks good questions and gives good answers to our return questions to the point we have a pretty high understanding of his brother's needs so we can recommend something that is going to be cheap, and hopefully as hassle-free (simple) as can be.

 

It's the same when guys roll in thinking they want Quad6600's and dual 8800GTX's but have a monitor that only does 1280x1024 and he only plays WoW. Should we recommend what is usually a considerable expense as well as headache when he only needs say an E6400 + 8800GTS 320MB? I don't feel comfortable with it, and neither do a lot of our members who have also moved on from the need to have bleeding edge components and the bleeding edge problems that arise with said components.

 

Not trying to single just you out nghisus, though it might seem like it. This is just my usual speech every quarter to give all the new members a bit of direction when it comes to using your very powerful voice in this particular section.

 

Because the voices in this section speak louder than all the other sections combined except maybe the OCDB/SSDB section. Probably louder because this is the place where people make real-money decisions by asking for opinions. If they just read teh OCDB/SSDB, they don't have to ask us, they can just buy the parts and pieces the best overclockers used to get their OCDB entry(s).

 

Here it's about giving the best bang for the buck with the least amount of hassle. You'd maybe be surprised that even as a member with few posts the impact you can have on someone's purchasing habits. That's one of those damn Spider-Man things about 'great power needs great responsibility' or whatever comic-book wisdoms that is actually sage advice.

 

 

So remember, just because you and I have to have watercooled quad-core cpu's with dual watercooled Crossfire cards and 4x 500GB drives in RAID-0 with no backup plan other than a dvd-rw doesn't mean we should be recommending something like that to someone who isn't in our same circle of experience or knowledge (or skill). Recommending what we like and use is great, but put the user who posed the question at the forefront, and keep his/her best interests in mind when giving advice.

[Angry_Games]

he's going to be recording his own music pretty much, thanks for the great info A_G.

 

is this the card you were talking about?

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16829102014

 

well, is he recording music say off records and cassettes to digital? Or is he making music with software like VirtualDJ or Soundforge or CuBase etc? Or is he plugging in instruments or MIDI and recording direct?

 

Each of those scenarios recommends a different audio card, so tell us in a bit more detail exactly what he'll be doing audio-wise, as we seem to have covered the video thing pretty good

 

Besides, I just pimped you up in my previous reply as a smart guy who asks good questions and gives good detailed replies to our return questions lol. Don't make me look bad! :tooth:

[Dan42684]

well, is he recording music say off records and cassettes to digital? Or is he making music with software like VirtualDJ or Soundforge or CuBase etc? Or is he plugging in instruments or MIDI and recording direct?

 

Each of those scenarios recommends a different audio card, so tell us in a bit more detail exactly what he'll be doing audio-wise, as we seem to have covered the video thing pretty good

 

Besides, I just pimped you up in my previous reply as a smart guy who asks good questions and gives good detailed replies to our return questions lol. Don't make me look bad! :tooth:

 

I spoke a bit with him today he's going for the Q6600 and the gigabyte P35. He had bad experience with XP in the past but I've convinced him that XP has been fixed since it first came out since I've built my system about 4 years ago and still haven't had any problems at all. Basically he didn't realize that when OS first come out they usually have a few bugs that needs to be worked out. Anyway, he's creating his own music with it, wants to use Midi as far as what he has told me. I haven't gotten any nitty gritty details about other needs as far as music recording.