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WARNING about bios bug in 7/04 beta bios


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dont question dodge, he main beef here is the fact that users, operating stock or otherwise, are forced to use beta bioses because the last official is pretty crap, all other manufacturers manage to release official bioses fixing the relevant problems, why cant DFI? this is somewhat of an unfair deal on the stock user who just needs to get compatability is it not?

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What AG is saying is correc t. If you increase your cpu vcore above stock, you have voided your warranty on that as well technically. Bios 704 even if it was release, is fine as long as you don't overvolt beyond the stated point. DFI is no different than any other company on this.

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im not arguing that. im arguing the fact a stock user is technically forced to void their warrenty just to get the desired compatability fix to solve their problem, this is wrong and also has the convenience for DFI as being a get-out clause for RMAing because the user was forced to use a beta where DFI wont release an official

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im not arguing that. im arguing the fact a stock user is technically forced to void their warrenty just to get the desired compatability fix to solve their problem, this is wrong and also has the convenience for DFI as being a get-out clause for RMAing because the user was forced to use a beta where DFI wont release an official

you always have a choice of not using a specific piece of hardware, whether it is a certain processor, mainboard, vid card, memory, etc.

 

no one is forcing anyone to purchase and use anything.

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and trying to set, what would be stock voltages on the cpu, could cause blowing it.

 

For example vcore=1.2 mult=1.23 for 1.48 -- but if I understand this right moving from vcore=1.5 mult =1.04 for 1.56 to the above setting would put 1.85 on your cpu.

 

The user did not overvolt the cpu, dfi's bios bug did.

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and trying to set, what would be stock voltages on the cpu, could cause blowing it.

 

For example vcore=1.2 mult=1.23 for 1.48 -- but if I understand this right moving from vcore=1.5 mult =1.04 for 1.56 to the above setting would put 1.85 on your cpu.

 

The user did not overvolt the cpu, dfi's bios bug did.

 

this is incorrect.

 

if you boot the board up to stock without clocking or touching anything, it will recognize the cpu @ whatever the stock voltage is and you do not have to change it.

 

there has never been a BIOS for the NF4 that cannot recognize the correct voltage for a stock cpu.

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So, AG what you are saying is that if a user modifies any settings of a released/offical bios, then they have voided their warrenty???

 

p.s.

 

more importantly, dfi would not be responsible for damage done by bugs in the bios

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you always have a choice of not using a specific piece of hardware, whether it is a certain processor, mainboard, vid card, memory, etc.

 

no one is forcing anyone to purchase and use anything.

 

how about DFI just make it work like every other manufacturer manages to do with no problem?

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I'm still on 3/10 BIOS. I really don't feel comfortable flashing to a beta BIOS. I use beta software all the time, but when it comes to my system BIOS/Drivers I get a little sketchy using beta stuff.

 

This issue with the 7/04 BIOS has made me even more scared to try a beta BIOS. Even though I have heard people have probs with corsair luckily my memory runs perfectly on the 3/10 BIOS.

 

However, I would like to see a new official BIOS in the near future. :cool:

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So, AG what you are saying is that if a user modifies any settings of a released/offical bios, then they have voided their warrenty???

 

p.s.

 

more importantly, dfi would not be responsible for damage done by bugs in the bios

come on now...you know this and have known this since the first overclocking options showed up on the first boards way back in the Celeron days...no company takes responsibility for overclocking because the boards, regardless of what they are designed for, are only guaranteed and warrantied to stock useage.

 

period.

 

there isn't any more of a clarification that I can give you. But like I said, you already know this as there has never been a company that guarantees running out of stock speeds/voltages.

 

Take even OCZ VX4000 for example..it is warrantied to what...3.5v @ 250Mhz (DDR500). that is what the warranty is for...if you can't get 251Mhz or use 3.7v then you have voided the warranty. Overclockers know this and have always known this.

 

AMD cpu's and DFI boards are no different.

 

The option to drive 150mph in a Corvette is there...but will Chevy buy you a new engine (or leg, or whatever) if you crash the car @ 138mph? Even if the wheel fell off?

 

no they wont.

 

it still surprises me that I get these questions...just because your motherboard might have overclocking options...you still have to consider the cpu, memory, vid card, hdd's, etc...none of those components are guaranteed at anything but rated speeds/voltages. The motherboard is no different.

 

Again...you have the option to drive 150mph down the highway...but that doesn't mean you should or that it is safe (to you or your car or others on the road). But still people do it.

 

as I've said many times repeatedly, you start overclocking or changing any stock settings and you are in your own risky territory. Car mfg's try to make sure the car is safe @ 150mph...but there's no guarantees that it will do 150mph and there's no guarantees that it will be a safe ride at 150mph.

 

DFI is no different. YOu have the option to overclock to ungodly speeds...but we don't make any guarantees that you will overclock nor the type of overclock you get, and we don't make any guarantees that it won't be harmful.

 

like a car company, we try to test everything we can to make sure that you don't have an issue...but we can't always guarantee that once you leave stock settings that anything will be a positive experience.

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Well, here we have 3 sides... 1 is arguing that more official bios's should be released more often so that it's not ALWAYS at the user's own discretion to give it a shot to see if it fixes their troubles with hardwar compatibility.

 

Another side is arguing that BIOS's being released shouldn't have fatal bugs like this, be it BETA or NOT (I'm in this category).

 

And the third side is arguing that you shouldn't even overclock in the first place, and that if anything happens (EVEN not as a direct result of overclocking), you are the one to blame.

 

Well shoot me if I'm wrong, but what's the point of manufacturers even having PC4000/4800 RAM (hell even OCZ have some DDR600+ RAM made specifically for DFI NF4 series), all these weird and wonderful heatsinks and other cooling gear? They literally encourage users to overclock - On the boxes of many motherboards they have big advertisements about how good at overclocking they are, and what safety features they have.

 

Overclocking has come to a point in the last 2-3 years where if you were even half-interested, you would probably be doing some overclocking. HECK, many manufacturers even overclock the CPU for you without you even knowing (just to name a few names - MSI, Gigabyte). Then what, does AMD say, "hey no, the board had set up the CPU speed by 100mhz and increased voltage by 0.05v, sorry, bad luck, you overclocked it"?

 

No they don't, let me explain why.

 

FIRST OFF, CPUs and other components don't just die unless you're running a voltage higher than the tolerance limit of its manufacturing process. Not to mention, with many lines of CPUs in the past, certain higher-end CPUs were simply overclocked/overvolted versions of the slower ones. In the case of this BIOS - the motherboard, NOT the user, pumped in stupidly high volts into the CPU (in my case, I calculated it to be 2.02volts into my venice, killing it instantly).

 

If you look on xtremesystems forums - the only CPUs/RAM dying are the ones being pumped at very high voltages, used with extreme cooling, and quite literally taken beyond reasonable speeds.

 

I'm not saying DFI is WRONG in this case - hell - I admit that I AM RESPONSIBLE for the death of my CPU because I had made the choice to even overclock it in the first place. HOWEVER, I feel that as an overclocker - I DID NOT do anything that was ill-advised. I simply downloaded the BETA BIOS to see if it made my G.Skill BH5 work properly - and voila it fixed my memory compatibility problems, and I wanted to get a voltage abit above 1.55 (which is the max you can set without ABOVE VID % control), and so I set 1.20 * 133%, which, mind you, has been fine in every BIOS I've tried so far, giving me a nice 1.56 vcore.) And then, whaddya know, some new BIOS bug that fries ur CPU.

 

As any right-minded person can see, I'm not condemning DFI at all, I'm simply trying to emphasize that such fatal bugs really should not exist in the first place, be it a beta or alpha or whatever. DFI is not obligated to do anything about my case, which is fine, but if these BIOS's keep introducing such costly and fatal problems in BETA BIOS's, then one must question who and how these BIOS's are being written/tested.

 

AG, you used an example that if you drive a car at 150mph and if the wheel falls off, bla bla bla, etc... You are comparing apples to oranges. It simply does not apply. If you crashed the car, at ANY speed, they will not replace anything - because you, as the user are responsible for accident. If you wanted to compare cars to CPUs, then using your perspective, it means that if I didn't mount the cooler properly (user mistake), but I didn't overclock the chip at all, and it died - they will replace it for me. EVIDENTLY this isn't the case.

Don't take this as an offence - I'm not trying to prove you wrong or anything - and in fact the majority of the points you have listed are VALID. However, there is a difference between VALID and REASONABLE. You, of all people should understand that DFI makes boards for overclockers, probably over 90% of boards sold are to people who want to use the overclocking features implemented on the board (otherwise why put it there in the first place?), Now, if the board starts killing hardware when the user hasn't made any fatal error (ie, no cooling on ram that's overvolted to 3.4 volts, or, setting 2 volts for the CPU), then you cannot deny the fact that there will be alot of unhappy people, many of which are experts in overclocking, and had they chosen a different board, the same BIOS/manufacturer fault would not have existed. Then again, OF COURSE, different manufacturers would have their different problems as well.

 

However, sadly, it's no secret that currently, DFI boards are killing the most hardware compared to other boards, for example the 4V jumper issue (which again, was a BIOS problem, as a fix was released), and now this.

 

I really like the vast amount of options available in DFI boards, and who knows, I may buy one again in the future. But it's evident that between the NF2/NF3 754 boards to the NF4 series, alot more danger has arised.

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