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Black64

[SPOILERS] - Star Wars VII Thoughts

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So I just watched Star Wars VII last night and I was actually enjoying the first few minutes of it until I became so confused and thought to myself, how is this new Star Wars? I mean, the movie didn't tie in to episode 6 in any way at all, which for me, would have made the entire movie awesome! However it didn't. 

 

The new "empire" seemed exactly the same to old empire, they had a powerful general, a powerful sith and even more powerful sith leading from the shadows. Which IMHO, should have been Darth Sidous or Darth Plageous. Heck, I think Darth Maul should have at least been in this! I mean come on, where did these "new sith come from? And how is the empire so strong again? Really a death star 3? I cringed so hard when they fired that thing, it's already been done twice! TWICE!

 

The new "Rebels" seemed to also be exactly the same as the old rebels, they had princess, a general and an admiral, but what's this? Luke Skywalker is lost/hiding? He should have had like 50+ jedi trained up in these last 20 years since episode 6? And why was his lightsaber in some crate in the basement of a bar and it wasn't even locked?

 

 

But the absolute worst part was (and yes and I am going to say it) a shot by shot reboot of episode 4! Don't believe me? Here are the points that both movies share in order.

 

1. Empire attacks rebels

2. Key rebel character gets captured by powerful leader with red lightsaber

3. Key rebel character gives important info to droid 

4. Droid escapes to desert planet

5. Unaware lead character finds droid

6. Unaware lead character almost doesn't want droid  

7. Unaware lead character is a great pilot

8. Empire is searching for droid on desert planet

9. lead character escapes desert planet on Millennium Falcon

10. Key role model character dies at the hands of the lead villain

11. Rebels blow up Death Star

12. The end...

 

Where is the plot? We barely know anything about this new sith lord, Luke was found at the new end with no new jedi ever being trained and yet some how there are 2 sith lords again?!?! Luke stop staring out into the water from some island go kill these sith! They already killed Han Solo and 5 planets while you were chilling out on a beach you slacker!

 

I mean the light saber battle at the end, come on! 2 people with no knowledge of the force or how to even use a lightsaber are some how fantastic with it! In episode 3 we saw young jedi getting killed by clones while holding there own lightsaber, with some training! And your telling me these 2 characters in episode 7 did just find in a battle with stormtroopers and a sith lord??!?!?!  :whoa:  :whoa:  :whoa:  :whoa:

 

 

I am sure there are many more parts of the movie that were followed far to close to episode 4. I will say the entire movie itself was actually great, however the story line killed, or should I say destroyed the entire movie for me. What made episodes 1-6 great was this awesome backstory about a sith lord rising from the shadows, only to be defeated by a chosen one. Episode 7 had two great options to play off this, continue with the story line set in the expanded universe OR create a new deep original story, it failed to either, because it simply copied Episode 4...

Edited by Black64

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My interest in seeing the EPVII has now diminished further. And my previous prejudice was based on the fact that I was a big fan of the EU, I because disenchanted with everything after vector prime but that is a separate resentment.Sounds like a "routine cash grab" as Bob Chipman? would say.

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I agree that the story line left quite a bit to be desired, however I enjoyed the movie. Better than Episode I no matter how you spin it lol.

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My interest in seeing the EPVII has now diminished further. And my previous prejudice was based on the fact that I was a big fan of the EU, I because disenchanted with everything after vector prime but that is a separate resentment.Sounds like a "routine cash grab" as Bob Chipman? would say.

 

 

I agree that the story line left quite a bit to be desired, however I enjoyed the movie. Better than Episode I no matter how you spin it lol.

To me the story is key, it what makes me want to come back and watch the next episode. I feel episode 1 was still better though, it had a better lightsaber fight, better battle scenes and better locations. IMHO. The locations in episode 7 was dull and earth like, desert, forest, winter forest and rocky island, I mean really? Those are so earth like and dull.

Edited by Black64

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Without spoiling any more of the story for people who haven't seen it but are still reading this topic...

 

I disagree.   I thought it was a great movie.   In the three trilogies we have different factions within the same Empire.   The empire was never defeated, just the faction in a much larger enemy that controls galaxies.   Let that soak in a bit and think of all the ramifications of what happens when an Empire controls that much territory.   Also why would the empire stop making their most powerful weapon - a planet destoyer?   The United States can no longer drop nukes on anyone, if we obey the rules, but do we still make them?  Oh you bet we do.   And the Empire improved upon their design, quite significantly.  If I was the empire I would continue making planet busters and just improve upon the design.

 

They are clearly introducing new heroes so why would our new heroes be gimp and not know how to fight?   Finn has genetics and training to be a fighter despite his mind being confused with him trying to figure out how he belongs in the world and going against his programming.   Rey was introduced as someone who knows how to fight as she lives on her own in a very rough environment where knowing how to fight means getting food.

 

The bad guys are NOT sith.   Again, we have different factions within a very large empire.

 

 

There were a lot similarities in the formula of this movie but I think you spent too much time looking for them and not enough time looking for the clues.   Some were pretty obvious and you missed them.   Makes me think you went in wanting to hate the movie.   We had to sit next to a couple who sounded like Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons.   All movie long... "OMG really???"  "OMG that again!"  "That would so not work!"  "Worst movie ever!"  Ya that got real old.   Why people come to the theater to talk during the movie I don't know.   But I point this out because they clearly did not have an open mind when they came in.   It wasn't even 5min and they were already bad mouthing everything.

 

There were similarities yes but to be fair it is a sequel in a large chain of movies.   But there were also key differences in the heroes and the villains which I won't go into detail about as it would spoil the clues.   And figuring out how they are going to progress each of these characters from those clues makes it a fun movie.   But wth here are a few...

 

- Why is Finn different?  How did he brake his programming?

- Why is Rey different?

- How come Kylo Ren is so conflicted?  One minute he is calm with exacting precision, next he is going off the deep end.

- Who is Supreme Leader Snoke?   Why does he look so extremely different from everyone else?

- We were told why Luke left and went into hiding but is that the full reason or will more be exposed?

 

And there are far bigger questions which I'd rather not post.   There is a story, it just wasn't handed to us on a silver platter.   This movie was more about introducing the new heroes and villains and giving us familiarity so it felt like a Star Wars movie.   After Episodes I-III it is a good tactic.   This also why they went back to the fencing style light saber fights and disowned the Wu Shu fight style choreography.   They had to bring back what the Star Wars fans originally fell in love with because Episodes I-III alienated most of their fan base.   Most of their fans are not debating if this was a good movie or not.   They are asking how it competes with Empire Strikes Back.  Sorry but it is a good movie.   No doubt many people will dislike the movie as you did, but this movie re-engaged Star Wars fans and re-ignited interest in Sci-Fi movies again.

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It's funny at work because a work with a few hardcore star wars guys and we are all split on weather or not the movie was good.  :teehee:

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I just saw it tonight. The movie was good, but not great. Like many diehards, my favorite is Empire Strikes Back, then A New Hope, and then Return of the Jedi. The Force Awakens is now 4th, but that's not saying much.

 

The Good:

  1. Overall, good main characters all around. I liked Po, BB8, Finn, Rey, Han, and Chewy. I didn't think Kylo Ren's character was that good, and Leia was less snappy, but they weren't bad.
  2. It was an enjoyable movie. It had funny moments, sad moments, some good action and landscape visuals.
  3. I felt like I was back in the Star Wars universe.
  4. Chewbacca's rage moment after Han dies.

 

The Bad:

  1. Not enough character development with Po and Captain Phasma.
  2. They left out how Po got out of Jakku.
  3. Captain Phasma wasn't badass.
  4. General Hux's speech was lame, and so was his character.
  5. Too much similarities to A New Hope. Black64, you even left out a cantina scene.
  6. Too many nods back to A New Hope.
  7. The Force Awakening of Rey was just too sudden. She can suddenly force pull and fight with a lightsaber to best the 3rd most powerful force user in the Galaxy (saying Snoke is first, then Luke)?
  8. The rest of the Rebellion pilots besides Po.
  9. Hey, where's Wedge Antilles? He was the only pilot aside from Luke to survive all 3 episodes of the main trilogy. At least have him as a Rebel pilot instructor.
  10. Camera movement was to swooshy, if that's a thing.
  11. R2D2's low power mode and sudden Awakening.
  12. A stormtrooper decides to stop being a stormtrooper, and then suddenly has good aim.
  13. A stormtrooper has Finn dead to rights, but wants to have a lightsaber/electro whatever duel?

 

The Ugly:

  1. Horrible, horrible CGI monsters. I can't even find the name of them online. Everyone is just calling them horrible CGI tentacle monsters. Definitely not needed.
  2. Han Solo's death was too easy to see coming, and really not the way anyone probably wanted the death of his character to be done.
Edited by El_Capitan

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Ya I talked with one today who wasn't thrilled by it.   He was hoping for more "reveals" because the latest book exposed everything the movie had so he wanted more.   He did say it was a good movie but is waiting till the next movie before he truly passes judgement.   He is also a little annoyed that Disney is dismissing any book written within the last 30yrs that deals with content after Episode VI.   He reads all the books so I can see why he would be annoyed by that but I also see why Disney didn't want to try and keep 30yrs worth of books in line and write something that makes for a good movie.

 

Everyone looks for something different.   Regardless of what others think, I think it was a great movie and worthwhile sequel to the original trilogy.   The last 3 movies (episodes I-III) were so horrible I have zero desire to see them again.   Not even to keep the story straight.

 

 

This review touches on a lot of what we discussed.

 

 

 

This video explains the difference between the Sith and the new baddies, Knights of Ren (SPOILERS)

 

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One thing I do know is that the really nerdy looking dude sitting next to me in the theater was actually crying when the movie started he was so excited. Same guy when leaving the theater was like a 12 year old girl leaving a Justin Bieber concert. Nuff said lol.

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One thing I do know is that the really nerdy looking dude sitting next to me in the theater was actually crying when the movie started he was so excited. Same guy when leaving the theater was like a 12 year old girl leaving a Justin Bieber concert. Nuff said lol.

Lol, no one was crying when I saw it, but looking around, a lot of people had smiley faces.

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If you do not dissect it to look for the inconsistencies is it at least enjoyable? Is it a good watch if you just want to get engrossed in it for a couple hours? 

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If you do not dissect it to look for the inconsistencies is it at least enjoyable? Is it a good watch if you just want to get engrossed in it for a couple hours? 

 

Yes. It's a fantastic time if you go to just enjoy the movie instead of trying to punch holes in every little detail the movie doesn't tell you happens in the 30 years between Episode VI and VII. If it explained everything, we'd be at a four hour movie instead of a bit over two hours. Right now, it's much more in line with the Original Trilogy than the Prequel Trilogy. More explanations will hopefully follow in Episode VIII, just like how we got more explanations in Empire than we had in the first movie.

 

 

Also, background info from The Force Awakens: Visual Dictionary.

 

Peace Interrupted
 
After Years of Rebellion, the death of Emperor Palpatine gave the oppressed peoples of the galaxy undeniable evidence that the Empire could be defeated. A longing for freedom and peace drove a great tide of revolution from sector to sector, to the point where a truce - unthinkable at the height of the Galactic Civil War - was signed between the New Republic and the weakenend Empire. As one of its first acts, the restored Senate promptly passed the Military Disarmament Act. Many were convinced that the age of galaxy-wide conflict was over.
 
The New Republic
 
Following its great victory against the empire at the Battle of Endor, the Alliance to Restore the Republic rebranded itself as the New Republic, and shortly afterward a peace treaty - the Galactic Concordance - was signed with the remnants of the Empire. Believing that the Empire was no longer a threat, the New Republic turned its attention to reshaping galactic politics.
 
The First Order
 
The Galactic Concordance defanged the Empire's ability to wage war, with strict disarmament treaties and punishing reparations. The Old Empire withered away, becoming a remnant of political hardliners locked in a cold war with the New Republic, before eventually breaking away to reform in the Unknown Regions as the myseterious First Order.
 
The Resistance
 
The Resistance is a small private force created by Princess Leia Organa to keep watch on the movements of the First Order. Though she petitions the New Republic government for support, she finds the politics of the Senate too slow and too mired in self-interest to be of any help. The New Republic tolerates the Resistance, though it is wary of risking war with the First Order.

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