So Ya Think You Want to Go to Vista Huh???

[ReelFiles]

The same 1080P file that I can play fine and looks flawless from XP, just looks horrible on my TV using Vista. I had VIsta installed on my HTPC less than a week ago, but got rid of it within 3 days. I couldn't even play movies with VLC in DirectX mode and had to switch to OpenGL, which in turn kept the taskbar on top of my fullscreen window. No matter what I did or which program I used, every app had severe discoloration and shadowing on my TV. BTW Media Center is a POS, because it freezes up on me when fast forwarding or rewinding. Hell I had an easier time using Linux for my HTPC.

[Praz]

I found this particularly sad.

 

The encryption requirements render high-end graphics processing units less effective, he said, because the best of those products emphasize graphics performance over content protection. On Vista, US$100-video cards can thus outperform those that cost $1,000.

[Guest Lord Sauron]

Well read this and ya might have serious second thought!!!

 

www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt

 

Viper

 

 

And all of you need to stop reading someone's own FUD from someone who hasnt even owned or used Vista to do a technical analysis...

 

Peter Gutmann's Vista criticism has come under fire after his speech at the USENIX Security Symposium in August 2007. from George Ou (ZDNet) who challenged Peter Gutmann's claims that Vista Content Protection causes so much additional CPU utilization that it increases power consumption and causes global warming. Gutmann made many of the basic assertions in his paper on Vista content protection but made the more extreme statements at Usenix Boston 2007 as reported by PCWorld. Ou cited data that showed no measurable power differences between 5% and 15% CPU utilization on an Intel E6600 dual-core processor and then cited HD playback performance data from AnandTech which indicated less than 7% total CPU consumption during 1080p VC-1 encoded video playback. Ed Bott challenged some of Peter Gutmann's other claims. Ken Fisher challenged Gutmann's claim that Vista content protection extended beyond commercial content in to user generated content.

 

Gutmann admittedly doesn't run Windows Vista and stated in his paper: "Can others confirm this? I don't run Vista yet, but if this is true then it would seem to disconfirm Microsoft's claims that the content protection doesn't interfere with playback and is only active when premium content is present". This statement has recently been removed from Gutmann's website but an older PDF version the paper with that statement can be found here.

 

George Ou later reported that Gutmann relied on web forum postings for several of his key assertions such as excessive CPU and memory consumption in Vista’s Media Foundation Protected Pipeline (mfpmp.exe) and AudioDG (Windows Audio Device Graph Isolation) process. Ou's tests showed that the web forum data Gutmann relied on were not repeatable. Furthermore, CPU utilization was wrongly attributed to mfpmp.exe when in fact it was actually accounting for all the CPU consumption in mfpmp.exe and Windows Media Player 11 combined.

 

Also read here too before jumping to conclusions..

 

http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=284

 

I mean, really......

[Praz]

Don't really have to read anything regardless who might be writing it. Microsoft extending the availability of XP says it all. Demands from the OEM segment is what brought about the change. Financially they cannot afford the necessary tech support that Vista issues bring to the table.

[Guest Lord Sauron]

Don't really have to read anything regardless who might be writing it. Microsoft extending the availability of XP says it all. Demands from the OEM segment is what brought about the change. Financially they cannot afford the necessary tech support that Vista issues bring to the table.

 

Fine dont read or do anything... just live off other peoples' FUD to make your determination... real cool..

 

XP had exactly the same amount of FUD when it was released too, granted it got better after SP1, and Im sure Vista will be the same. Most people will adopt once SP1 is out of the door then we will get all the people screaming on how crap Vista Security is etc, just like they do on XP right now. No matter what M$ does they will always have a bunch of haters (and I myself am no lover) who spread lies or jump to thier own conclusions and parade them as facts when they havent even tested it themselves..

 

I have had zero Issues with Vista since Feb. No DRM issues apart from I cant do a file copy in Explorer of a copy protected DVD Movie. The simple workaround is to get some old Decryptor that works fine in Vista and lo! its on the HDD to do what you want to it.. Vista DOESNT stop you.. I can play 1080p and 720p HD content on my displays with ZERO issues (unlike the linked article in the OP states) with not so new hardware. Hell my wifes Notebook that has a lesser Vid card than mine in it with Vista Home Premium can do the same damn movie files, thus proving what he wrote was complete bunk in the first place. So the OP that somehow got stickied is a blatent lie and just pure unadulterated F.U.D and should not even BE a sticky in the first place. Angry's Sticked post is more fair as its his own opinion and some of it does ring true. But the fact is that DRM is only going to effect you if you have Blue-Ray, HD-DVD etc in your PC. For the most part I am pretty much certian that most do not, and even if you did that it would probably work perfectly if you did. After all if you have the money for that equipment then you will also follow it up with the hardware to run it correctly in the first place.

[Praz]

I don't need to read what anyone has to say to know about the state of Vista in it's present form. I have both the 32 and 64 bit Ultimate versions so that I can duplicate issues for tech support. And unlike XP most computer instability issues with Vista as the operating system is software related not faulty hardware.

 

If it works good for you that's all that really matters. But to openly proclaim that the top computer manufacturers, experts in the field and most of the top Fortune 500 companies are wrong makes you look foolish.

 

Enjoy, I'm outta here.

[Guest Lord Sauron]

But to openly proclaim that the top computer manufacturers, experts in the field and most of the top Fortune 500 companies are wrong makes you look foolish.

 

 

WTF??? Where did I say that??? Erm... Nowhere... My beef is that the LINK in the ORIGINAL POST in this thread is full of total lies... I have no interest in what Acer says and my argument wasnt even pointed at the Acer quote in the FIRST place. I totally understand where Acer is coming from. Just because it works for me doesnt mean its gonna work for the big picture.. My beef is with the original post link thats contains all lies that are totally unresearched by the author.

 

See Here

and here

and here

 

Plus the fact that you can easily try out for yourself what Gutman claims you cant do in his so called "accurate paper" from an "expert" who hasnt even researched what he claims in the first place and you'll find that you actually CAN DO IT in PRACTICE within Vista...

 

But anyway, thanks for putting words in my mouth that I never even said.

 

Now who looks foolish?

 

... Sheesh, its like being on a slashdot thread.

[shatteredsteel]

Hey is this sounding familiar to anyone else?

 

http://www.diy-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=80048

 

Maybe its just me...

 

BTW Sauron...check out the people's posts that have used vista...just not mine, because I will admit mine is biased as I am a devoted linux user (Windows is only for games I can't run on linux.)

[Guest Lord Sauron]

Hey is this sounding familiar to anyone else?

 

http://www.diy-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=80048

 

Maybe its just me...

 

BTW Sauron...check out the people's posts that have used vista...just not mine, because I will admit mine is biased as I am a devoted linux user (Windows is only for games I can't run on linux.)

 

... Look, I totally understand that people ARE having problems with it. Im not trying to say that they dont. I know of people who have problems with it (and damn weird ones at that) that makes it totally unusable for them. I am totally aware of that... So I'll spell it out again...

 

The Original post in this thread (that is stickied by the way) links to a paper that has been proven time and again that its full of lies. The points he makes in that paper are completely made up and you cannot reproduce the noncraptional (alledgedly) things he says Vista does... Its a bunch of FUD about the DRM aspects of Vista. How he can say that those are facts when he doesnt even use or own Windows Vista to actually back his (allegedly) factual paper up with test results is beyond belief.

 

You have bigger things to worry about with DRM software installed by Sony Music disks than you do about DRM on Vista...

 

I dont quite know what you are getting at with the link your provided. yes I see another thread about Windows Vista faults. Fine... Im not disputing the faults. What I am disputing in spreading false information thats based on lies and saying that its fact. I'm sure youd feel the same way if he wrote a paper saying Linux has killing DRM features and throws it around as the truth when it actually isnt. Its like watching a Nancy Grace telecast (Guilty guilty guilty (without a shred of evidence to back her claims up)) It needs to stop so some actual accurate reporting on the issues at hand can be done instead.

[Angry_Games]

well, list us fact-by-fact the things you are disputing so we can prove or disprove them with our own installations of Vista or by using factual reports/research from those that do use Vista, and then maybe we'll listen to ya.

 

In the meantime, we've got thousands of users on this forum that have walked away from Vista because of the exact things that they've encountered that have been reported in these links, so I'm not sure how whats in some of these links could be considered false/fake.

 

By using only a single reference about a guy who doesn't even use Vista as your argument that everything he says is a lie is dishonorable on your part. It's like me saying that Praz + ViperJohn + ReelFiles + Soundx98 + ExRoadie + technodanvan are all liars because they have run into the same issue using Vista and then told me, and I never used Vista but I just reported what they said.

 

How would I then be a liar? I wouldn't. I reported what everyone else was having issues with before I ever used Vista, and every issue that I reported second-hand to this forum turned out to be true first-hand when I installed that piece of . OS (over 250 times now thank you), and it is still true today for the most part since Vista has actually slid backwards since it's release.

 

When I have a $650 video card that cannot play back HD content, I'm extremely unhappy.

 

When I have 4GB of RAM that I paid $400 for and I still can only see 2.75-3.25GB in Vista, I'm pretty damn unhappy.

 

When I paid $500 for a video card and $200 for Vista and yet the drivers won't allow me to play my favorite games, I'm pretty unhappy.

 

When MS touts this OS as the most secure and stable OS EVER, and it's a bunch of bull crap that is easily proved just by reading ANYWHERE on the internet (let alone here at this forum where we trust each other to tell the truth and back it up), then who's lying to whom?

 

If that original paper has been proven to be nothing but lies, show us. Give us the truth and the proof and we'll consider it to be, otherwise, you are, in our eyes, defending the wrong party since we've all proven that what's in that paper as well as other links provided are TRUE from personal experience of installing this giant hunk of . and finding out first-hand.

[Guest Lord Sauron]

well, list us fact-by-fact the things you are disputing so we can prove or disprove them with our own installations of Vista or by using factual reports/research from those that do use Vista, and then maybe we'll listen to ya.

 

 

Did you even read the three links I provided?... Theres enough data in there with facts and actual documents to back up what I am saying about the original link in this thread... I have no qaulms or beef with users actually having problems, but they are not related to the thousands of words of FUD that Gutmann spouts..

[suedenim]

Thankfully we are all right.

 

Lord Sauron is probably correct about Gutmann being a dubious source of expertise or facts (I can't be arsed to read anything else the bloke has produced as I have little spare time as it is) so as a basis for starting a "Vista is ." thread I can see the issue there.

 

On the other side there is a consensus that "Vista is .". I work in IT and hear this A LOT. There are lots of companies refusing to upgrade to Vista (I'm sure there are plenty that use it too but I haven't seen big headlines screaming "Vista saved our business" etc. but then again that could be the press - good news is good, bad news is better!)

 

There's also the issue with the hardware manu's not bothering to write drivers for their hardware and all the software that is being slowly ported. Not having used Vista I can't comment on its compatibility features.

 

Now as most folks that are using Vista got it forced on their new PC purchase they are probably quite happy because all the hardware will work and the pre-installed software etc. etc. and as PC sales are much higher now than when XP came out it could be called an overall success.