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Samsung TCCC instability issue


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If I use a single module, it will be stable. If I add the second module to run either single channel (64 bit, which forces it in ddr333) or dual channel (128 bits), Memtest 86 integrated in the BIOS willl report errors, nonethless win xp will load, but reboot in few minutes.

 

These memory modules are generic samsung ones, their chips are K4H510838B-TCCC. At Samsung sites those chips are reported to be on 512 MB modules (8x64), but these are 1GB modules (16x64). I believe A64 memory controller has some issues with dual side modules, instead of single side modules, please confirm this. Samsung reports these modules as (3-3-3) and I could not find info on Tras, even though, the BIOS on Auto recognizes them as (3-4-4-8). The K4H510838B-TCCC actually means: K Memory, 4 Dram, H DDR SDRAM, 51 512 MB (should be 1G instead of 51, if single side chip), 08 x8 (organization, should be x16 on this module, or x8 if it was 8x128, whereas we are with 16x64), 3 4 banks, 8 SSTL-2 (2.5v, 2.5v), B 3rd generation, T TSOPII, C normal temp (0-70C), CC 400 Mhz (Trcd 3, Trp 3).

 

I tried to set them as 3-3-3-7, or 3-3-3-8, to see if the issue would be solved, no good. I tried to keep at 3-4-4-8, and get the 2.60v up to 2.70v to test if it would get stable, and it didn´t. I turned off CPC (which I believe why it became 2T at the time), but it still did not fix the issue.

 

I also tested each module separately, they looked stable and passed the memtest 86.

 

I wonder what could I try to make these modules work, or do I really have to get back at where I bought it and try to exchange for some other modules?? (if so, what cheap ones could I get?? Since money is an issue for now).

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That memory is similar to some Buffalo Tech had but you can see that NOone has any or NOone I have seen in here. You canNOT just set the 4 timings and get that stuff to run. It has got to be a FULL Dram Configuration setting and you will most likely have to do the testing YOURSELF, since no one has any of the stuff you have.

 

I am going to GUESS at some timings that might be correct or maybe better than you just trying the 4 timings change and nearly AUTO on all the rest. This is GUESS but you need to follow it very closely since it will NOT look like some others since the memory is odd.

 

Genie BIOS Settings:

 

FSB Bus Frequency - 200

LDT/FSB Frequency Ratio - 4x

CPU/FSB Frequency Ratio - 10x

PCI eXpress Frequency - 100Mhz

 

CPU VID StartUp Value - 1.40V

 

CPU VID Control - 1.325Volts

CPU VID Special Control - Above VID * 112%

LDT Voltage Control - 1.30v

Chip Set Voltage Control - 1.60v

DRAM Voltage Control - 2.70v

+0.03 vdimm - Disabled

 

DRAM Configuration Settings:

 

DRAM Frequency Set - 180=RAM/FSB:09/10 AND MIGHT go 200 1:1...

Command Per Clock (CPC) - AUTO

CAS Latency Control (Tcl) - 3

RAS# to CAS# delay (Trcd) - 04 Bus Clocks

Min RAS# active time (Tras) - 10 Bus Clocks

Row precharge time (Trp) - 04 Bus Clocks

Row Cycle time (Trc) - 10 Bus Clocks

Row refresh cyc time (Trfc) - 16 Bus Clocks

Row to Row delay (Trrd) - 04 Bus Clocks

Write recovery time (Twr) - 03 Bus Clocks

Write to Read delay (Twtr) - 02 Bus Clocks

Read to Write delay (Trtw) - 04 Bus Clocks

Refresh Period (Tref) - 3120 Cycles

Write CAS Latency (Twcl) - AUTO

DRAM Bank Interleave - Enabled

 

DQS Skew Control - Auto

DQS Skew Value - 0

DRAM Drive Strength - Level 7

DRAM Data Drive Strength - Reduce50%

Max Async Latency - 9.0 Nano Seconds

DRAM Response Time - Fast

Read Preamble Time - 6.0 Nano Seconds

IdleCycle Limit - 16 Cycles

Dynamic Counter - Enable

R/W Queue Bypass - 16 x

Bypass Max - 05 x

32 Byte Granularity - Disable(4 Bursts)

 

That should be one heck of a lot better than all the default settings when trying to use that stuff.

 

RGone...

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My DDR are very similar (1Gb Samsung TCCC rated 3-4-4-8).

 

My advice from stock settings: (In order of importance)

 

A) Diable CPC (mine don't like 1T)

B) Use 180/200 mem divider or 200/200 BUT NO OTHER DIVIDERS

C) Try 6/23 BIOS (romsip -1)

B) VDDR=2.8V (mine like more voltage)

 

Since you're having problems in multi-banks you may want to experiment with disabling/enabling DRAM Bank Interleave as well. I assume your mem sticks ARE installed in the orange slots? You should update your sig...

 

BTW these modules seem to like 2.5 CAS (mine run prime stable at DDR450 2.5-3-3-7).

 

Good luck and let us know your results...

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You are gonna need to adjust the drive levels for sure with older samsung when using 2 sticks or more.

With those you are likely to get over 266(533) easy enough, I did it with 2 sticks of tcb3 and a 3rd stick of tcc5 even on this old board.

 

Generic drive values work, but I don't know or understand the nf4 setup yet, I don't even know of all the setting it has for stuff.

Drive's are very inportant, they don't need to be right on to get a good oc out of it but still, they need to be setup.

 

Make sure that tREXT is set to 3 and not lower.

If you have such a setting.

Use CMD2, or CPC disabled, whatever it calls it.

Use cas3.

 

 

Btw that tccc is pretty old, not as old as tcb3 but still.

Look around for tccd or tcc5 setups on the nf4, then slack the heck out of it, because that's what you're gonna have to do.

You may get close to certain configs but still, like tREXT, with newer stuff you can go lower at higher fsb's, with old tuff, you need to use the slackest value for that one setting.

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Well, what Rgone told did not work, hehe. And Since it is not stable at stock, I did not try Ocing it. Maybe it is a noob atitude, lol, but I want to have the system stable at stock speeds.

 

I will try to exchange the modules. Just a question, if I get 4 512 MB modules (single side chips), will they work still in dual channel?? Will they work at 400 MHz??

 

That is just to broaden my choices at the retailer, is there any cheap 2 GB (1gbx2) I could look for out there?? (or generic samsung should work?? (cheap as around 100 US$ the module). And what about a 1 GB (2x 512) somewhat over 100 US$ per module??

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Hello,

 

4x512MB with your CPU will run at DDR400. (will need to manually specify the frequency)

Before you give up,

 

 

Make sure that all 4 power connectors are plugged into the board

# 24pin ATX connector.

# 4pin +12v P4 connector, near the ATX connector.

# Floppy power connector, under the CPU socket.

# Hard drive power connector, on top the chipset fan.

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=2944&stc=1

 

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=2945&stc=1

 

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=2946&stc=1

 

Insert the memory into the Orange slots

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=2948&stc=1

 

Power your PC and enter the BIOS

# Change the following,

GENIE BIOS Setting

>DRAM Configuration..................Press Enter = New Menu

FSB BUS Frequency....................200

LDT/FSB Frequency Ratio..............X 5.0

LDT BUS Transfer Width...............16 16

CPU/FSB Frequency Ratio..............AUTO

PCI eXpress Frequency................100Mhz

K8 Cool 'n' Quiet Support............Disable

Cool 'n' Quiet MAX FID...............AUTO

CPU VID StartUp Value................StartUp

 

CPU VID Control......................1.4v

CPU VID Special Control..............104%

LDT Voltage Control..................1.20 V

Chip Set Voltage Control.............1.50 V

DRAM Voltage Control.................2.70 V

 

Run MemTest86+.......................Enabled, disable later

GENIE BIOS Setting >DRAM Configuration

DRAM Frequency Set (MHZ).............200 (DRAM/FSB:1/01)

Command per clock (CPC)..............Diabled, Enable later

Cas latency (tCL)....................3

RAS to CAS delay (tRCD)..............3

Min RAS active time (tRAS)...........8

Row precharge time (tRP).............3

Row cycle time (tRC).................11

Row refresh cycle time(tRFC).........14

Row to Row delay (tRRD)..............3

Write recovery time (tWR)............3

Write to read delay (tWTR)...........2

Read to write delay (tRWT)...........3

Refresh period (tREF)................AUTO

Write CAS latency (tWCL).............1

DRAM Bank Interleave.................Enabled

 

DQS Skew Control.....................AUTO

DQS Skew Value.......................0

DRAM Drive Strength..................Level 8

DRAM Data Drive Strength.............Level 3

Max Async Latency....................6ns

Dram Response........................AUTO/Normal

Read Preamble Time...................5ns

Idle Cycle Limit.....................AUTO

Dynamic Counter......................AUTO

R/W Queue Bypass.....................AUTO

Bypass Max...........................AUTO

32 Byte Granularity..................AUTO

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I'm not sure but I don't think the nf3's and nf4's have that setting, even though it's really inportant...(hint hint, blah)

 

I will grab what Sharp said in his post and add on to it for some basic stuff:

 

GENIE BIOS Setting

DRAM Voltage Control.................2.80 V (Don't bnother with 2.7v for now, it's probaly not good for anything anyways)

 

 

GENIE BIOS Setting >DRAM Configuration

DRAM Frequency Set (MHZ).............200 (DRAM/FSB:1/01)

Command per clock (CPC)..............Disabled

Cas latency (tCL)....................3

RAS to CAS delay (tRCD)..............4 (What the hell?, no seperate read and write for this?)

Min RAS active time (tRAS)...........8 (or 4)

Row precharge time (tRP).............4(Gonna have to be 4 if there's no tRCDW :)

Row cycle time (tRC).................11 (or 9)

Row refresh cycle time(tRFC).........14 (Or 13)

Row to Row delay (tRRD)..............0!!!! (absolute must...)

Write recovery time (tWR)............3 (I have no clue...)

Write to read delay (tWTR)...........3 (Or 2)

Read to write delay (tRWT)...........3 (Or 4, try upping later for lower cas or cmd)

Write CAS latency (tWCL).............1 (???, use 3 if you got it for now)

 

There's some timings missing here...

tREXT should be from 3 down, very likely to be 3 on that memory.

tRTP(names tR2P on mine, would be named tRTP officially, in you bios it would be named tRPT lol...), should need a value of 6(or less).

tWTP, again another missing one that's really inportant, would be named like the tRTP that's missing, would start at 3 and go down to 2 before going down to 2 on tWTR.

tDOE, another one missing, needs! to be on 0.

 

:, kinda not cool with all those missing timings though...

I can't really help when the bios is missing parts that need to be there.

 

As for the drive strengths and slew rates man, I have no clue when it comes to the newer boards.

From what I heard is that they got a diffrent setup for those, the values are diffrent I guess.

So I don't know what my values would look like in your bios.

Kinda like that tREF, the way it's setup in the newer boards is complete bs, makes me wonder if it's fake or what on those.

 

In any case, find out what others use on high clocks for samsung tccd or tcc5.

This should be ok for the time being just to get it running at a suitable speed.

 

As you can probaby tell, I'm not the best one for helping out on this.

If you had more timings in the bios I could defently help out for the most part except for the drives.

 

 

I know that memory could do 266(533) min easy with the right timings in there.

As long as the bios was good enough, probably is good enough.

200mhz lol...

 

Edit:

If this is really the case, the timings missing.

Man, I would skip on the nf4's I guess and stick with my nf2.

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