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Upcoiming IB build. Please critique!


tbris84

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Seems like the people who keep saying the hydro coolers are useless are the people who have never used them. I've seen a couple people say they lowered their temps by going from a D14 to a H80 ...and those two are pretty much the same price.

 

Though if you're not going to OC at all I wouldn't spend much money on a fancy heatsink. About the only thing the hydro series will gain you is a cleaner looking build and the assurance factor your Vengeance ram will fit no problemo. While there are good reasons to go hydro, it is definitely not "water cooling", so I wouldn't buy one thinking Ooo boy I'm going WC! I would buy the hydro series for: great temps on load, cleaner look, no interferance with ram heatsinks, easier to install and no case limitation (except for the H100). Vice versa, the reason I would go with a D14 is the fans, while ugly as hell, are some of the best and quietest you can find. But why spend $80+ on a HSF if no plan to OC?

 

Motherboard: As Muchoman alluded to, you selected a Mini-ATX board with a HUGE case. Not the best combo. Even with an ATX board you will be surprised how small it feels once you start plugging in the pieces. I wouldn't go Mini-ATX unless the goal was to build in a small profile case. I probably would go with a Z77 board, but I would want a good sale on one ...right now prices are too high on the models I would buy.

 

CPU: As stated by many... I wouldn't commit to IB. Definitely keep it in mind and see how the prices pan out, but also put a 2400/2500 on the selection list.

 

GPU: I would rather spend more money here than on the CPU.

Edited by Fogel

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Seems like the people who keep saying the hydro coolers are useless are the people who have never used them. I've seen a couple people say they lowered their temps by going from a D14 to a H80 ...and those two are pretty much the same price.

 

Though if you're not going to OC at all I wouldn't spend much money on a fancy heatsink. About the only thing the hydro series will gain you is a cleaner looking build and the assurance factor your Vengeance ram will fit no problemo. While there are good reasons to go hydro, it is definitely not "water cooling", so I wouldn't buy one thinking Ooo boy I'm going WC! I would buy the hydro series for: great temps on load, cleaner look, no interferance with ram heatsinks, easier to install and no case limitation (except for the H100). Vice versa, the reason I would go with a D14 is the fans, while ugly as hell, are some of the best and quietest you can find. But why spend $80+ on a HSF if no plan to OC?

 

Motherboard: As Muchoman alluded to, you selected a Mini-ATX board with a HUGE case. Not the best combo. Even with an ATX board you will be surprised how small it feels once you start plugging in the pieces. I wouldn't go Mini-ATX unless the goal was to build in a small profile case. I probably would go with a Z77 board, but I would want a good sale on one ...right now prices are too high on the models I would buy.

 

CPU: As stated by many... I wouldn't commit to IB. Definitely keep it in mind and see how the prices pan out, but also put a 2400/2500 on the selection list.

 

GPU: I would rather spend more money here than on the CPU.

 

Cooling: It isn't a fancy, custom fab water cooling system, but it is "water cooling" which is a change of pace from what I'm used to. The reason I am interested in the Hydro series is because it is as efficient as high end air solutions while being much neater in the case. I don't have to worry about tall memory modules not fitting. If I knew more about custom water cooling to trust myself with configuring a setup I would definitely give it a shot, but unfortunately I don't.

 

Aside from the Hydro series, I was looking at the XSPC Rasa 750 RS240 kit for $130. Any experience with that?

 

MB: I see how a microATX motherboard would get lost inside an 800D case, but keep in mind the case isn't a one time use thing. The reason I'm humoring the idea of buying a microATX board is because I have to mitigate the cost of a case and power supply this time around. The next build and hopefully the build after that will allow me to reuse my case and PSU. So I want to make sure I get these two parts right. After looking it over though, I will probably be going with an ATX Gigabyte motherboard anyway. Not as pretty as the Maximus, but it has all the features I need.

 

CPU: I'm only waiting on IB to see how it compares to SB. If it beats it head to head I'll buy one but if SB proves to still be the better buy, I'll buy another 2500K.

 

GPU: If I had to buy one today it would be a 7870, but I am waiting for the GTX670 and GTX660 to be released before pulling the trigger.

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I had a completely different post written up, but instead of replying to points I will post up what my strat would be if I was building a new machine. We already know SB, so let's look at Ivy Bridge and Haswell.

 

Expected features of Ivy Bridge:

 

 

  • Tri-gate transistor technology (less than 50% power consumption at the same performance level as 2-D planar transistors).
  • PCI Express 3.0 support. - is this really a big deal if 2.0 isn't limiting technology?
  • Max CPU multiplier of 63 (57 for Sandy Bridge). - you won't be OCing
  • RAM support up to 2800 MT/s in 200 MHz increments. - who cares if you aren't OCing?
  • Intel HD Graphics 2500/4000 with DirectX 11, OpenGL 3.1, and OpenCL 1.1 support. - a dedicated GPU negates this advantage
  • The built-in GPU is believed to have up to 16 execution units (EUs), compared to Sandy Bridge's maximum of 12. - same
  • A new random number generator and the RdRand instruction, codenamed Bull Mountain.
  • Intel Quick Sync Video.
  • DDR3L low voltage for mobile processors.
  • Multiple 4K video playback.

 

 

Expected features of Haswell:

 

 

  • Expected features 32 nm PCH
  • A new cache design.
  • Thunderbolt technology (optional).
  • There will be three versions of the integrated GPU: GT1, GT2, and GT3. According to vr-zone, the fastest version (GT3) will have 20 execution units (EU). Another source, SemiAccurate, however says that the GT3 will have 40 EUs with an accompanying 64MB cache on an interposer. Haswell's predecessor Ivy Bridge will have a maximum of 16 EUs.
  • New advanced power-saving system.
  • Base clock (BClk) increase to 266 MHz.
  • Up to 8 cores.
  • 128 Bytes cache line.
  • 64KB data + 64KB instruction L1 cache per core.
  • Execution Trace Cache will be included L2 caching design.
  • 1MB L2 Data cache per core and up to 32MB L3 cache shared by all cores.
  • New sockets — LGA 1150 for desktops and rPGA947 & BGA1364 for the mobile market.
  • Fully integrated voltage regulator, thereby moving another component from the motherboard onto the CPU.
  • 25, 37, 47, 57W TDP mobile processors.
  • 77/65/55/45/35W and ~ 100W+(extreme edition) TDP desktop processors.
  • 15W TDP processors for the Ultrabook platform (multi-chip package like Westmere).

 

 

Now that's a real architecture upgrade. Haswell releases in 2013. But you may not be interested in Haswell so let's just discuss IB vs SB. Do you see anything in the IB design you truly need? Outside of IB being the new kid on the block and it really feels good to have new, is there anything you truly could benefit from on IB?

 

The only thing I truly like is the native USB 3.0 design and that really only matters if I plan on having the machine 5yrs from now so that when USB 3.0 devices are more common I don't feel my lack of 3.0 ports are holding me back ...but even then, I usually only have 1 device plugged in at a time ...sometimes 2.

 

I would come up with a Sandy Bridge build and a Ivy Bridge Build. You will be spending a lot more money on the IB build because the motherboards are more expensive and you likely won't get a deal on the CPU. Where as there are already places selling a 2600k for $200. Buying a 2600k on sale makes more sense to me than buying IB.

 

Buying SB you can buy a really nice Z68 board and an awesome video card. If I prioritized my parts for a gaming rig it would look something like below.

 

  1. Video Card
  2. Motherboard
  3. PSU
  4. CPU
  5. SSD
  6. Case
  7. MEM
  8. Cooling - no OC means no worry

 

The video card is by far the most important component for a gaming rig. The motherboard is basically the foundation of the entire build and decides your upgrade potential. Picking the PSU at this point will force you into thinking what future upgrade potential you want - do you see yourself going SLI/CF? A super hard OC and SLI/CF? Or simply running stock with a slight chance of a possible OC? The reason I list the CPU here is because you simply have to pick an architecture. Once you pick the architecture you are going with, it really doesn't matter after that unless you are playing CPU intensive games like RTS and MMO. Most games wouldn't care if it is 2120 or a 2500. If you were using your rig for more intensive activities (3d rendering, CAD, etc.) than I would bump up the CPU to #1 ...but I'd also bump up MEM to #2. Picking SSD is important, especially if it is the only HDD in the build. The case is important to me but I can sacrifice on the case to beef up the areas above it. For gaming you really only need 4GB of memory but most people pick 8GB because memory is so cheap these days. If you aren't OCing the cooling strategy is really no big deal ...especially if you buy a nice case. You could easily go stock until more funds free up and then go with a hydro cooler ...especially if the urge to OC kicks in.

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Thanks for the reply Fogel,

 

I'm definitely interested in Haswell. I like to build a new machine every 12-18 months. I built my 2500K system back in November, the only reason I am doing it again so soon is because I was able to sell that system for a profit and I had a spare Phe2 X4 955 laying around.

 

There is nothing Ivy Bridge itself has that I need, but the Z77 chipset has Virtu MVP which I would like to play with and Display Swapper(w/e it's called). The Z77 boards are the same price as their Z68 predecessors. The only SB boards that are cheaper than the IB boards are the P67's. I want the extra HDMI/DVI port on the motherboard especially if I don't CF/SLI and I get a GPU like the 7950 that only has 1 DVI and 1 HDMI. My next set of displays will most likely have DisplayPorts but just incase I would like the safety net of an extra HDMI.

 

I agree with your USB3.0 point, but I already have 2 USB3.0 External HDDs. If I were to get a third I'm stuck with USB2.0 on most boards. The Gigabyte board I'm looking at has 6USB3.0 ports, a USB3.0 header for additional ports as well as 4 SATA3 connections. Not bad for $150.

 

As far as the CPU itself, I'm going with a 2500K or 3570K. I loved my 2500K and I'm not against getting another if the IB ends up like Bulldozer. I would be happy as hell to see the 3570K launch and retail for $220 and buy a 2500K for $195 or less after the price drop.

 

Z77 and Z68 are the same price, so there's no reason NOT to get a Z77.

 

What I'm looking at now:

 

XFX HD7950 $400

Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H $150

Corsair AX750 $170

i5-2500K/3570K $220

OCZ Agility 3 120GB SATA3 $100

Corsair 800D $250 (Only $55 more than the 650D, worth it IMO)

Corsair Vengeance DDR3-1600 2x4GB $50

XSPC Rasa 750 RS240 kit $130

-or possibly custome water cooling if I can get help selecting the hardware

 

Totals $1340 without the cooling...under $1265 after combos and MIR's.

 

I really like that Silverstone TJ11 with the 90 degree rotated motherboard tray on the other side... very cool, very expensive case. I'm looking for one similar to that only simple like the 800D.

Edited by tbris84

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Seems like the people who keep saying the hydro coolers are useless are the people who have never used them. I've seen a couple people say they lowered their temps by going from a D14 to a H80 ...and those two are pretty much the same price.

 

Well with the increased price of the D14, the H80 only cost $8 more. I can't vouch for the H80 but I've used the H100 on a 2500K and when compared to the D14, I can only see 2-3oC drop. Now the H100 cost a full $20 more so I don't see why you'd want to spend $20 more for only 3oC difference? Unless you have RAM or clearance issues. Also the H100 is L-O-U-D at full speed! Nothing compared to the D14.

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What I'm looking at now:

 

XFX HD7950 $400

Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H $150

Corsair AX750 $170

i5-2500K/3570K $220

OCZ Agility 3 120GB SATA3 $100

Corsair 800D $250 (Only $55 more than the 650D, worth it IMO)

Corsair Vengeance DDR3-1600 2x4GB $50

XSPC Rasa 750 RS240 kit $130

-or possibly custome water cooling if I can get help selecting the hardware

 

Totals $1470...under $1350 after combos and MIR's.

 

Why the Agility3? The Agility3 uses asynchronous NAND so it's going to perform slower then Synchronous NAND. I suggest looking at the Vertex 3 instead.

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Just because of the price. How about the Corsair Force GT 120GB or the Samsung 830 128GB. This is my first SSD, I don't know much about them.

I would say this patriot pyro se 120gb for $140 after MIR

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820220624

 

Edit: Have a look at this for PSU and HDD

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.905063

 

I assume you still need a HDD in your PC?

So for $165 after MIR you can get a 750 watt high quality PSU that is 80+ silver rated and comes with a 7 year warranty, the HDD is your standard 7200rpm 1tb drive from seagate.

Edited by Stonerboy779

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I would say this patriot pyro se 120gb for $140 after MIR

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820220624

 

Edit: Have a look at this for PSU and HDD

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.905063

 

I assume you still need a HDD in your PC?

So for $165 after MIR you can get a 750 watt high quality PSU that is 80+ silver rated and comes with a 7 year warranty, the HDD is your standard 7200rpm 1tb drive from seagate.

 

I've never used any Patriot products in the past, is it better than the Force GT? Same goes for PCP&G PSU, I've been using Corsair and Seasonic for all my builds since the early 2000s so I'm sticking with one of them.

 

I have a 1TB Samsung SpinPoint F3 internal and 2x 3TB Seagate GoFlex USB3.0 externals, so I'm pretty set as far as storage is concerned. Just looking for a Windows boot drive with enough room to fit at least a half dozen games.

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Patriot has been one of leaders in memory for quite some time.

 

Which is why I trust them in my phone and camera, micro sd and sd cards respectively. In my laptop another laptop and my htpc, alp running patriot purl se SSDs. Don't have any patriot ram atm but have in the past.

 

PC P&C I have never used them (US only) however more than a few members here will swear by their quality. I would buy them if I could but well I can't the 750 watt is still only $90 (an $80 saving on the corsair PSU you where looking at). Do not forget they are willing to honor 7 years of warranty on their product.

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