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1366--->1155 or 1150?


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#1 IVIYTH0S

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 04:00 PM

So...I'm pretty fed up with the X58 chipset and this blasted motherboard so I'm looking to go newer but I have some complications

 

Before, I saw that a 3570K system was really not that much cheaper than a 4670K system... but the problem is that my cooler (Zalman CNPS9000MAX) does not have mounting hardware for 1150. I guess I could call up Zalman and see if they could send me one but when I searched to see if anyone's done that before...nobody has.

 

I guess I could get another cooler but that adds to the cost of the upgrade and I really like my Zalman. It cools great and is SUPER quiet. (should cool better on a newer system)

 

Basically it breaks down to these choices

 

1) 2500K/3570K w/ some P67/Z68 board, possibly used and maybe I'd spring for a 2600K or 3770K if the price was right. $$

 

2) 4670K w/ (most likely) the AsRock Fatal1ty Z87 board, since it has a nice helping of USB 3.0 ports (something that's important to me, though I could save some money and go for a Pro or Extreme and probably be just as happy) BUT I'd have to likely get a new cooler. $$$

 

I would probably just reuse my memory in dual and single channel since I've never seen any real world difference running my system as such on my current machine (if I run in triple channel one of the sticks doesn't show up...and now it started to do it again, even in my dual/single config.....I hate this motherboard so much). I've thought about maybe trying to hunt down a 4th stick or selling the 3rd but I could just use it as is.

 

So any thoughts??

 

I guess Sandy would be good since it'd be the cheapest and coolest *without the need to delid*, I may have to go price out a dream new 1155 and see what the current cost differences are. (with 3570K and decent enough Z68)


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#2 El_Capitan

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 04:13 PM

From experience with many parts that pass through...

 

1. Don't get a P67 board, they just don't last. Z68/GEN3's have been solid. The used market i5-2500K's have been around $135 and i5-3570K's have been around $150. You can get lower-end but decent Z68/GEN3 or Z77 boards for as low as $80 used, good ones for $110, and great ones for $150.

 

2. Although I like ASRock boards when they work, if you get one, get them new. They don't have transferable warranty, and it's a painful process as it is getting an RMA with them if something does go wrong with your board.

 

That said, if you can find an Ivy or Haswell CPU, especially one that's been delidded, you can just get yourself a $20 (or even cheaper CPU cooler) like the CM Hyper 212+ or 212 EVO and run 4.6GHz pretty darn well comfortably with it.

 

If you're using 3 sticks of RAM, you'll still be running dual memory, except for the 3rd stick. You can always find a 3rd 4GB stick from somewhere for like $20 sometimes.

 

The only problem with a Sandy Bridge CPU is that they do run a bit hotter than a delidded Ivy and Haswell CPU, mostly due to higher voltages needed for an overclock. Still, most likely an i5-2500K at 4.5GHz at 1.35V's with a Hyper 212+ might get you temps as high as the low 80's during load, which isn't bad. It's just that a delidded i5 3570K at 4.5GHz might only take 1.2V's, and with a Hyper212+ would get you temps in the high 60's during load, plus run about 10% faster.

 

If you're not delidding an Ivy or Haswell CPU and expect 24/7 overclock at 4.5GHz at around 1.2V's, just know that even when custom watercooled, a 3570K I had reached upper 80C temps during extended runs on Prime95 (longer than 30 minutes), because of the non-soldered IHS.

 

It gets a bit confusing, but you could run an i5-3570K at 4.2GHz for as long as you want 24/7 with something like a Hyper 212+, because it would take maybe 1.05V's or so, not enough heat to build up from the internal TIM on the IHS, and maybe never get past 60C during load. An i5-2500K at 4.2GHz would take maybe 1.25V's, but temps with a Hyper 212+ might end up being in the low 70C's during load. So an i5-2500K isn't always going to be cooler than an i5 3570K. It just depends on the circumstances.

 

I played around with undervolting my CPU's at 3.4GHz, and a delidded i5-3570K was able to get stable with as low as 0.85V's. You could just do that, would still be faster than your i7 920 at 3.8GHz, and temps wouldn't ever get past 50C during load on probably the stock cooler, lol.


Edited by El_Capitan, 11 May 2014 - 04:35 PM.


#3 IVIYTH0S

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 04:58 PM

From experience with many parts that pass through...

 

1. Don't get a P67 board, they just don't last. Z68/GEN3's have been solid. The used market i5-2500K's have been around $135 and i5-3570K's have been around $150. You can get lower-end but decent Z68/GEN3 or Z77 boards for as low as $80 used, good ones for $110, and great ones for $150.

 

2. Although I like ASRock boards when they work, if you get one, get them new. They don't have transferable warranty, and it's a painful process as it is getting an RMA with them if something does go wrong with your board.

 

That said, if you can find an Ivy or Haswell CPU, especially one that's been delidded, you can just get yourself a $20 (or even cheaper CPU cooler) like the CM Hyper 212+ or 212 EVO and run 4.6GHz pretty darn well comfortably with it.

 

If you're using 3 sticks of RAM, you'll still be running dual memory, except for the 3rd stick. You can always find a 3rd 4GB stick from somewhere for like $20 sometimes.

 

The only problem with a Sandy Bridge CPU is that they do run a bit hotter than a delidded Ivy and Haswell CPU, mostly due to higher voltages needed for an overclock. Still, most likely an i5-2500K at 4.5GHz at 1.35V's with a Hyper 212+ might get you temps as high as the low 80's during load, which isn't bad. It's just that a delidded i5 3570K at 4.5GHz might only take 1.2V's, and with a Hyper212+ would get you temps in the high 60's during load, plus run about 10% faster.

1. Yeah I was thinking of a Z68 or Z77 (forgot to mention the Z77) if I went with 1155... and I'm an idiot. The Zalman website says my cooler is "compatible with 1150" which must mean there is a mounting bracket available which makes me happy :) . Where are you finding them that cheap?

Ebay trends have been:

2500K: $80,$110,$125, $126, $130 since Feb and two most recent auctions ending at $134.50 and $165 respectively

3570K: $103.51, $107.50, $140, $150 since Feb and two most recent auctions ending at $150 and $190.50

4670K: $150, $150, $172.50, $180 since Apr and two most recent auctions ending at $180 and $187.50

I'm betting on a lot of sellers knowing this (on forums or CL) and pricing their chips somewhere close to that, so the used market is actually kinda garbage right now :-/

 

2)Yeah we'll see, I'll probably find the model I want (seems like AsRock has the best features for the money everytime) and then procure whichever chip I find and then hunt down a used or new board.

If i had to get a new cooler I would just get a 212 but it looks like I probably won't have to luckily.

 

Yeah I know I'm running Dual/Single, just wasn't sure if I wanted to throw in that extra 4GB OR just run 8GB and put less strain on my CPU/board. (for what little it's probably worth lol). I couldn't find single sticks of my memory but I'd probably just throw in a 4th stick of whatever at the same speed. I've had good luck with mis matching in the past.

 

Oh really?? I thought the Sandies were still cooler even after delidding (shows how little I know)

 

Anyway, here's my "if bought new" configurations:
 

A)3570K + AsRock Z77 Pro4 $338 ($321 if microcenter)

 

B)4670K + AsRock Fatal1ty $344 (could save a little money getting the CPU at a Microcenter but with tax it may not be with the 20-30 minute drive...so about $327 then)

 

Used estimates

C) Used 3570K (assuming $150) + Board (probably buy new for $112)  $262+

 

D) Used 4670K (Assuming $190) + Board (found for $90) $280+


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#4 cchalogamer

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 06:16 PM

 The Zalman website says my cooler is "compatible with 1150" which must mean there is a mounting bracket available which makes me happy :) .

Nope, you already have the bracket, 1155 and 1150 (and possibly 1156 but I never had one of those and am far too lazy to look it up) have the same spacing for the mounting holes :)

 

As for Haswell vs Ivy vs Sandy.   They're all nice :lol: Sandy will give you a higher OC, but not always higher performance, Ivy bridge is a nice balance but you're buying into an older socket with either of those, Haswell takes some getting used to as far as the OCs go with the VRM on chip design but you get support for all the new features like AVX2 and in many apps the lack of many 5Ghz OCs is made up for with other tweaks.

 

No way I would upgrade from Sandy to Haswell if I already had a nice Sandy system, but in your case (I went 775 to Ivy personally) I would get the current generation for the gains it does offer.  Also deliding is easy and will take care of the crappy intel TIM easy enough on the 22nm CPUs :D

 

Also if you want to save even MORE money, I have one of these http://www.newegg.co...N82E16813131983 behind me sitting in a box doing not a thing that I need to get rid of before I do something stupid like buy a CPU to put in it :lol:


1zdcjtx.png

i7-4930K/GA-X79-UP4/32GB G.Skill & Team Vulcan Mixed/512GB Crucial M550 SSD/240GB Seagate 600 SSD/3TB/R9 290X/GTX 750Ti/Rosewill Capstone 750 (main rig)

i7-4770K/GA-Z87X-UD5H/16GB ADATA/240GB Seagate 600 SSD/3TB/2 x 1TB RAID 1/1.5TB/GTX 670/Rosewill Capstone 750-M (secondary location main rig)

i7-4810MQ/Sager N8258-S/16GB/120GB mSATA/2 x 1TB/GTX 880M/180W AC Adapter w/8 cell battery (gaming laptop)

i5-4300Y/Dell Venue 11 Pro/8GB/256GB/Intel HD 4200 (GT2)/25W Ac Adapter w/removable 2 cell battery (Win 8 Pro Tablet)

i5-3570K/GA-Z77X-UD5H/16GB Kingston HyperX/500GB/3 x 2TB/2 x 320GB RAID 1/Antec BP550 (server)


#5 Waco

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 08:45 PM

1155 and 1150 are the same size. :)

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#6 IVIYTH0S

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 11:00 PM

 

The Zalman website says my cooler is "compatible with 1150" which must mean there is a mounting bracket available which makes me happy :) .

Nope, you already have the bracket, 1155 and 1150 (and possibly 1156 but I never had one of those and am far too lazy to look it up) have the same spacing for the mounting holes :)

 

1155 and 1150 are the same size. :)

DOH! You know I was hoping that was true... (or perhaps it was the fact that I used to know that but forgot and half remembered?) Thanks though that brightens my day even more!

 

 

As for Haswell vs Ivy vs Sandy.   They're all nice :lol: Sandy will give you a higher OC, but not always higher performance, Ivy bridge is a nice balance but you're buying into an older socket with either of those, Haswell takes some getting used to as far as the OCs go with the VRM on chip design but you get support for all the new features like AVX2 and in many apps the lack of many 5Ghz OCs is made up for with other tweaks.

 

No way I would upgrade from Sandy to Haswell if I already had a nice Sandy system, but in your case (I went 775 to Ivy personally) I would get the current generation for the gains it does offer.  Also deliding is easy and will take care of the crappy intel TIM easy enough on the 22nm CPUs :D

 

Also if you want to save even MORE money, I have one of these http://www.newegg.co...N82E16813131983 behind me sitting in a box doing not a thing that I need to get rid of before I do something stupid like buy a CPU to put in it :lol:

 

Thanks for the tips, I'll likely go with Haswell because of how shitty the used market is for sandies and ivies right now, damn people buying them for so much :-/

 

Yeah I wouldn't even upgrade at all but I'm fed up with the memory inconsistency on this platform and wouldn't mind some native USB 3.0 ports (I have an add in card but native would always work for things like Hirens and all)

 

Maybe if you make me an offer I couldn't refuse...though it's slight lack of USB ports is disturbing. Honestly that's one of the first things I look at in a board. I'd LIKE 4 USB 3.0 ports but 2 would be ok but there should be atLEAST 4 USB 2.0 (which yours has) ports for my mouse, keyboard, battery analyzer and whatever else I may use them for that may require compatibility over speed.... this board and my last board have spoiled me with USB 2.0 ports (my EP45 extreme had 8 USB 2.0 ports!!)


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#7 DanTheGamer11

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 07:50 AM

The Haswell refreshes are coming soon(June supposedly) so keep that in mind, along with the Z97 series motherboards. Think there will be some price drops or something


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#8 IVIYTH0S

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 09:41 AM

There is barely any price difference between ivy and haswell now so I doubt there will be when the new haswell-e's come... and unless the z97 boards are going to have 4+ USB 3.0 ports standard, I doubt they'll have anything else I'd be interested in haha

 

Thanks for the mention though.


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Mobo: Asus P8Z68-V-PRO | Processor: Intel Core i7 2600K @ 4.6ghz | CPU Cooler: Zalman CNPS9900MAXR | Videocard: MSI Twin Frozr HD7970
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#9 El_Capitan

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 10:03 AM

You have to play the lottery on the Haswell CPU's for high overclocks (but I don't think it will apply to you). People have been having difficulties getting past 4.6GHz on 4770K's, but that's almost equivalent speedwise vs a 3770K at 4.9GHz. Just throwing that out there.

 

A note for USB 3.0's and USB 2.0's ports for motherboards. At least with mid-to-higher end ASUS boards, they'll always have at least 4 USB 3.0 ports, and also a 2-port USB 3.0 header or whatever for either the front panel, or for an adapter that's usually supplied. However, you can always just buy a USB 3.0 hub with a power adapter if you need more space. I've got an 6-port one that I got for $40 on sale that works amazingly well. You can also get a 4-port USB 3.0 PCIE adapter for $20.

 

So, you could find a decent $80 lower-end board and a $20 USB 3.0 4-port USB adapter for $20, or just get a higher end motherboard for $150. :P


Edited by El_Capitan, 12 May 2014 - 10:03 AM.


#10 El_Capitan

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 12:53 PM

I sold my 2500K for $145 shipped, but someone's selling a delidded one for $135 shipped here:

 

http://www.overclock...-i5-2500k-delid

 
He says temps did drop by 9C, but that could mean anything.
 
You can also get an ASUS Sabertooth Z77 for $110 (not sure if price includes shipping) here:
 
 
That's $242.
 
However, the best used deal I see right now is for an i7-3770K and an EVGA Z75 motherboard for $280 shipped. You could probably haggle for $270 shipped.
 


#11 IVIYTH0S

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 05:55 PM

:woot:  that 3770K and motherboard just about has me.... I am literally holding back my mouse hand from clicking the PM for him. This is what I get for not considering i7s :pfp:

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Well I pm'd him and offered $270, let's see if he bites! :D


Edited by IVIYTH0S, 12 May 2014 - 06:06 PM.

"GilliumX58" DESKTOP
Mobo: Asus P8Z68-V-PRO | Processor: Intel Core i7 2600K @ 4.6ghz | CPU Cooler: Zalman CNPS9900MAXR | Videocard: MSI Twin Frozr HD7970
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Monitor: Samsung 30" 305T | CD/DVD: Samsung SH-S223F | Keyboard: Razer Tarantula | Mouse: Razer Lachesis

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#12 El_Capitan

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 06:10 PM

:woot:  that 3770K and motherboard just about has me.... I am literally holding back my mouse hand from clicking the PM for him. This is what I get for not considering i7s :pfp:

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.

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Well I pm'd him and offered $270, let's see if he bites! :D

 

Lol, that didn't take long. I was still replying to your post before it got edited.  :lol: