Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Okay all you left wingers, explain this.

politics

  • Please log in to reply
25 replies to this topic

#1 SpeedCrazy

SpeedCrazy

    Life is one heck of a ride, so hang on tight!

  • Folding Member
  • 3817 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Between birth and death.

Posted 16 March 2013 - 07:29 AM

So.... I was reading this morning that Maryland is planning to abolish the death penalty.

First i was like "Okay, whatever, its not like they use it anyway."

I was then reading an interview with the governor of the state and his comments on the deal, he instigated it,

 

 

"Evidence shows that the death penalty is not a deterrent, it cannot be administered without racial bias.."

 

 

And i was like, hmm okay i can see where you are coming from.

Then i read his next statement:

 

"...it costs three times as much as life in prison without parole,"

Then i was like: ????????? What in the world? What has this country come to that it costs more to kill a death row inmate than to feed clothe and look after them for their whole life? Seriously?

So i looked it up, and according to this article in 2008 it cost $37.2 million to kill one convict in Maryland. SERIOUSLY?????  As a rule i don't cuss but at this point i am definitely thinking what the hell is wrong with this country?

 

So someone, and yes I'm picking on the left because most of the right i know are in favor of quicker and cheaper execution, please explain this.


Edited by SpeedCrazy, 16 March 2013 - 07:29 AM.

Fold for Team OCC


i7 930 @ 3.9 || Dual-SLI GTX 250 || ASUS P6X58D-E || 3x2GB G.Skill Pi @ 1600 || Corsair TX850w || 2x WD Caviar Black 500gb


#2 AkakmanH

AkakmanH

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 141 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Dallas, Texas

Posted 16 March 2013 - 07:51 AM

Yep, I saw the same story which had absolutely no backup explamation. My guess is that all of the appeals and court appointed attys plus court costs are what make up most of the cost. And, no, I am not a lib. I do, however, live in Texas.


Edited by AkakmanH, 16 March 2013 - 07:52 AM.


#3 SpeedCrazy

SpeedCrazy

    Life is one heck of a ride, so hang on tight!

  • Folding Member
  • 3817 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Between birth and death.

Posted 16 March 2013 - 07:56 AM

Yep, I saw the same story which had absolutely no backup explanation. My guess is that all of the appeals and court appointed attys plus court costs are what make up most of the cost. And, no, I am not a lib. I do, however, live in Texas.

Still its excessive. I can buy a .44 bullet for almost 37 cents. Lot better than 37 million.


Fold for Team OCC


i7 930 @ 3.9 || Dual-SLI GTX 250 || ASUS P6X58D-E || 3x2GB G.Skill Pi @ 1600 || Corsair TX850w || 2x WD Caviar Black 500gb


#4 IVIYTH0S

IVIYTH0S

    They call me... General Help.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 20517 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Pennsauken, NJ

Posted 16 March 2013 - 08:12 AM

I'm more often "liberal" but I support a quick and cheaper execution to life "in welfare"

"GilliumX58" DESKTOP
Mobo: Asus P8Z68-V-PRO | Processor: Intel Core i7 2600K @ 4.6ghz | CPU Cooler: Zalman CNPS9900MAXR | Videocard: MSI Twin Frozr HD7970
Memory: Patriot 8GB 1600mhz | OS SSD: SanDisk Extreme 240GB SATA | PSU: PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750W
Monitor: Samsung 30" 305T | CD/DVD: Samsung SH-S223F | Keyboard: Razer Tarantula | Mouse: Razer Lachesis

OCC Cool Club Member

 
 

 

GPU Comparison tool on AnAndTech


#5 El_Capitan

El_Capitan

    Even the sun goes down

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6593 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Somerville, MA

Posted 16 March 2013 - 08:37 AM

I don't know why it has to do anything with "left wingers". It's the "right wing" states that usually have the death penalty, and why it's so expensive, they're the ones that should explain themselves.

 

Anyways, look at Florida. They send the most inmates to death row, but also have the highest number of death row inmates who were later exonerated, acquitted, or had their charges dropped. That's one good reason to get rid of the death penalty. Our Justice System evolves as technology advances, where there's more evidence to correctly convict someone, it gives the judge and jury more insight in making a better decision.

 

Our legal system is setup by our government, led by greedy politicians, in a Capitalistic society. The only reason I think it would cost so much.



#6 Coors

Coors

    ????? ????

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3638 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Missouri

Posted 16 March 2013 - 08:59 AM

 

Yep, I saw the same story which had absolutely no backup explanation. My guess is that all of the appeals and court appointed attys plus court costs are what make up most of the cost. And, no, I am not a lib. I do, however, live in Texas.

Still its excessive. I can buy a .44 bullet for almost 37 cents. Lot better than 37 million.

 

Rope is cheap and it can be used more than once lol


MSI MPower Max - 4770K - 2x EVGA GTX780 ACX - 2x8GB Crucial Ballistix Tactical 1866 - 2x Crucial M4 256GB raid0 - Enermax 1020w - HP ZR30w

Sager NP9170 - i7 3720QM - GTX680m - 16GB 1600Mhz - 2x Crucial M4 256GB - 17" matte display

Shuttle SP35P2V2 - E8600 4Ghz - eVGA 8800GTX ACS KO - 2x2GB g.skill PK - Samsung 500GB - 2x Dell E228wfp


#7 ccokeman

ccokeman

    Frank <3 Reesa

  • Reviewer
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11475 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 16 March 2013 - 09:07 AM

$37 million is excessive. It's the time it takes to finally reach the point where the appeals process has played out and the convict can be executed.  There is no foolproof method of confirming guilt  but the impact of DNA testing has had both positive and negative results for the system. When you rely on witness testimony there is that chance for mistaken identity. It happens and has happened throughout history with far fewer "innocents"  paying that ultimate price now than any time in the past. The system has evolved. The reason the death penalty is losing its impact is the amount of time it takes to pay the price for the crime and that we do not see the dirty work of the executioner any longer. Its as cold and impersonal as possible.  

 

If the death penalty does not work, neither does the life without parole option.  Make it swift and make it public and there should be some impact. There is no such thing as swift justice anymore.......... 


Processor Intel Core I7 920 @ 3.6
Memory Mushkin 998995 Blackline 12GB 9-9-9-24
Motherboard MSI X58 Big Bang
Graphics ASUS GTX 580
Power Corsair AX 1200,
Monitor Gateway UXD3000, LG W3000H, ASUS VG236 x 3
Water Cooling By DangerDen & Swiftech
Follow OCC on Posted Image

#8 SpeedCrazy

SpeedCrazy

    Life is one heck of a ride, so hang on tight!

  • Folding Member
  • 3817 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Between birth and death.

Posted 16 March 2013 - 09:16 AM

I don't know why it has to do anything with "left wingers". It's the "right wing" states that usually have the death penalty, and why it's so expensive, they're the ones that should explain themselves.

 

Anyways, look at Florida. They send the most inmates to death row, but also have the highest number of death row inmates who were later exonerated, acquitted, or had their charges dropped. That's one good reason to get rid of the death penalty. Our Justice System evolves as technology advances, where there's more evidence to correctly convict someone, it gives the judge and jury more insight in making a better decision.

 

Our legal system is setup by our government, led by greedy politicians, in a Capitalistic society. The only reason I think it would cost so much.

I picked on the left as they tend to be the ones who make the systems so slow. and hence expensive. I agree tech is changing things but once we are as certain as we can be about guilt we ought to quickly and publicly execute them.

 

$37 million is excessive. It's the time it takes to finally reach the point where the appeals process has played out and the convict can be executed.  There is no foolproof method of confirming guilt  but the impact of DNA testing has had both positive and negative results for the system. When you rely on witness testimony there is that chance for mistaken identity. It happens and has happened throughout history with far fewer "innocents"  paying that ultimate price now than any time in the past. The system has evolved. The reason the death penalty is losing its impact is the amount of time it takes to pay the price for the crime and that we do not see the dirty work of the executioner any longer. Its as cold and impersonal as possible.  

 

If the death penalty does not work, neither does the life without parole option.  Make it swift and make it public and there should be some impact. There is no such thing as swift justice anymore.......... 

Why is there no like button on staff posts?


Fold for Team OCC


i7 930 @ 3.9 || Dual-SLI GTX 250 || ASUS P6X58D-E || 3x2GB G.Skill Pi @ 1600 || Corsair TX850w || 2x WD Caviar Black 500gb


#9 Guest_Jim_*

Guest_Jim_*

    ANTITHAT

  • News Editor
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4504 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 16 March 2013 - 01:08 PM

I don't know why it has to do anything with "left wingers". It's the "right wing" states that usually have the death penalty, and why it's so expensive, they're the ones that should explain themselves.

 

Anyways, look at Florida. They send the most inmates to death row, but also have the highest number of death row inmates who were later exonerated, acquitted, or had their charges dropped. That's one good reason to get rid of the death penalty. Our Justice System evolves as technology advances, where there's more evidence to correctly convict someone, it gives the judge and jury more insight in making a better decision.

 

Our legal system is setup by our government, led by greedy politicians, in a Capitalistic society. The only reason I think it would cost so much.

I normally tend to avoid these political discussions, but I just have to comment on these points.

First, you're claiming that the "right wing" is responsible for making it more expensive simply because it is "right wing" states with the death penalty is woefully naive. To explain I'm going to bring up something even more controversial than this topic. Please understand that this is not to cause the topic to digress, but only because it is a good comparison. Look at what is happening with abortion in, what you would likely call, "right wing" states. New laws and regulations are being put in place by the "right wingers" to deter the use of abortion, because they oppose it but cannot stop it. Impairing it is the best they can achieve. If "left wingers" cannot stop the death penalty then they too will attempt to impair it by instituting new laws and regulations to deter it, which increase costs.

You see, my point is that thanks to the system of government we have, even if the majority viewpoint is one thing, the implementation can be greatly effected by the minority viewpoints.

 

Your reasoning for getting rid of the death penalty because mistakes can occur in the judicial system is also faulty because truly that thinking implies, with as much strength, to the suggestion that the judicial system itself should be gotten rid of because of the mistakes it has made. That is utterly ridiculous.

That reasoning would be better put to use arguing for automatic appeals for any death sentence and a strengthening of the appeal process, to diminish the likelihood of a mistake. This is also an argument just about anyone will agree with, by the way.

 

 

Costs are high because the money has to be spent for one thing or another, such as the appeals process. Also, keeping the prisoners throughout the process and, I believe many of them are kept in solitary, which is more expensive than keeping them in the general population, add to the costs.

 

By the way, I do not support the death penalty. I just think your arguments are crap, which is why I'm commenting on them.


Processor: AMD A10-5800K @4.40 GHz (44.0x100)
Cooling: Corsair H110
Motherboard: ASUS F2A85-M PRO
GPU: EVGA GTX 770 2 GB
PhysX: EVGA GTX 570 1280 MB
RAM: G.Skill Ripjaws 4x8 GB (32 GB total) at 1866 MHz 10-10-10-27
PSU: OCZ Fata1ty 750 W
OS: Windows 7- Professional 64-bit
Guest_Jim_*.jpg

 


Needs more tigers.

Steam Inventory. Let me know if something interests you.


#10 El_Capitan

El_Capitan

    Even the sun goes down

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6593 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Somerville, MA

Posted 16 March 2013 - 01:16 PM

 

I don't know why it has to do anything with "left wingers". It's the "right wing" states that usually have the death penalty, and why it's so expensive, they're the ones that should explain themselves.

 

Anyways, look at Florida. They send the most inmates to death row, but also have the highest number of death row inmates who were later exonerated, acquitted, or had their charges dropped. That's one good reason to get rid of the death penalty. Our Justice System evolves as technology advances, where there's more evidence to correctly convict someone, it gives the judge and jury more insight in making a better decision.

 

Our legal system is setup by our government, led by greedy politicians, in a Capitalistic society. The only reason I think it would cost so much.

I normally tend to avoid these political discussions, but I just have to comment on these points.

First, you're claiming that the "right wing" is responsible for making it more expensive simply because it is "right wing" states with the death penalty is woefully naive. To explain I'm going to bring up something even more controversial than this topic. Please understand that this is not to cause the topic to digress, but only because it is a good comparison. Look at what is happening with abortion in, what you would likely call, "right wing" states. New laws and regulations are being put in place by the "right wingers" to deter the use of abortion, because they oppose it but cannot stop it. Impairing it is the best they can achieve. If "left wingers" cannot stop the death penalty then they too will attempt to impair it by instituting new laws and regulations to deter it, which increase costs.

You see, my point is that thanks to the system of government we have, even if the majority viewpoint is one thing, the implementation can be greatly effected by the minority viewpoints.

 

Your reasoning for getting rid of the death penalty because mistakes can occur in the judicial system is also faulty because truly that thinking implies, with as much strength, to the suggestion that the judicial system itself should be gotten rid of because of the mistakes it has made. That is utterly ridiculous.

That reasoning would be better put to use arguing for automatic appeals for any death sentence and a strengthening of the appeal process, to diminish the likelihood of a mistake. This is also an argument just about anyone will agree with, by the way.

 

 

Costs are high because the money has to be spent for one thing or another, such as the appeals process. Also, keeping the prisoners throughout the process and, I believe many of them are kept in solitary, which is more expensive than keeping them in the general population, add to the costs.

 

By the way, I do not support the death penalty. I just think your arguments are crap, which is why I'm commenting on them.

 

Well, to your point of abortion, I always thought it was quite hypocritical of the "right wing" to want a smaller government, yet impose a law to prevent a woman in making her own choice about what she can or can't do with her own body. That's another off topic discussion, anyway.

 

If you think the judicial system is perfect, that's your prerogative. In my opinion, nothing is perfect, but to strive towards perfection means constant evolution of making things better. That's progress. I said no such thing about getting rid of the judicial system, so I don't even know why you're coming in with that. That is utterly ridiculous even bringing that up.

 

I think your arguments are crap, too, but I'd rather not try to win an internet argument, so you win.



#11 Guest_Jim_*

Guest_Jim_*

    ANTITHAT

  • News Editor
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4504 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 16 March 2013 - 01:40 PM

Well, to your point of abortion, I always thought it was quite hypocritical of the "right wing" to want a smaller government, yet impose a law to prevent a woman in making her own choice about what she can or can't do with her own body. That's another off topic discussion, anyway.

 

If you think the judicial system is perfect, that's your prerogative. In my opinion, nothing is perfect, but to strive towards perfection means constant evolution of making things better. That's progress. I said no such thing about getting rid of the judicial system, so I don't even know why you're coming in with that. That is utterly ridiculous even bringing that up.

 

I think your arguments are crap, too, but I'd rather not try to win an internet argument, so you win.

Perhaps you would have a higher opinion of my arguments if you actually read them properly and did not respond with a straw-man argument. I never once used the word 'perfect' to describe the judicial system. I stated that its appeal process and its ability to correct its mistakes are a strengths. Based on your statements you agree with me on this, so how about you stop trying to make an opposite out of your opponents so you can evolve yourself to something more perfect through a better understanding of other people.

My point was that your argument is flawed because identical logic can be applied to a ridiculous notion. Hence why I said, "truly that thinking implies." I never said it to suggest you believe that but to encourage you to reexamine your argument. This is also why I gave an alternative conclusion to that logic.


Processor: AMD A10-5800K @4.40 GHz (44.0x100)
Cooling: Corsair H110
Motherboard: ASUS F2A85-M PRO
GPU: EVGA GTX 770 2 GB
PhysX: EVGA GTX 570 1280 MB
RAM: G.Skill Ripjaws 4x8 GB (32 GB total) at 1866 MHz 10-10-10-27
PSU: OCZ Fata1ty 750 W
OS: Windows 7- Professional 64-bit
Guest_Jim_*.jpg

 


Needs more tigers.

Steam Inventory. Let me know if something interests you.


#12 VaporX

VaporX

    Sapphire Gaming Evangelist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1710 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Carbondale, Il

Posted 16 March 2013 - 01:50 PM

This statement stood out to me as much as the cost...

 

 

 

"Evidence shows that the death penalty is not a deterrent, it cannot be administered without racial bias.."

 

I am so sick of hearing this horse shit shoveled. I heard the other day of a school that has the federal government investigating if they give detention to more black kids. Now I understand that if the same number of kids of all races are getting into as much trouble and the one race is the only one getting detention but the issue seems that more of one race was actually getting into trouble.

 

Look I understand that at times we see statistics that seem disproportionate to the cultural makeup that that often is just the way things fall. I mean should we say Basketball need s a federal investigation because there are more blacks in it? Should we say that schools teaching physics should be examined because so few blacks take the courses?

 

Most so called racial bias is not a bias but the people but a cultural choice. You cannot legislate that away if you want true equality. People should be equally allowed to do stupid things and pay the price for them. Not make the price less for one side because they do the stupid thing more often in one region.


Edward "Vapor-X" Crisler

Sapphire North America PR Represenative

"I don't play when it comes to gaming"

 






Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: politics